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MadMarchMasterchef
On 15/10/2020 at 8:10 AM, MsLaurie said:

I run a Guides group (so wildly biased), but to me there are two core differences-

1) Scouts is mixed boys and girls, Guides is girls only. Which suits will depend on your kid and the other kids in the group. 

2) Scouts tends to be more structured in its age groups and badges requirements, Guides tends to be more flexible and “self directed”.

But the core goals and philosophies are basically the same.

Not always, but in general, Scouts requires more direct input from families than Guides do.

For both organisations though, a lot is down to the local leaders and their vibe and priorities, so don’t be afraid to have trial sessions at different units if there’s a few in the area. The right mix for your kid in terms of adults and other kids is the most important part in it being an enjoyable activity.

Does guides these days do as much of the outdoor activities as scouts?    I was a guide as a kid and found the activities unrelateable ( eg polishing silverware when I was from a very low income family)  and I switched to scouts because they had more hiking and camping.   That was nearly 40 years ago though so i assume its a lot more modern now. 

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MsLaurie

It depends a lot on the local leaders. I think in general Guides (at an organisational level) has a lower appetite for risk than Scouts, but not significantly.

But what mix of risky activities each unit does depends on local preferences. My unit, for example, doesn’t do a huge amount of camping as our leadership team don’t have much weekend availability. But we do build rope bridges between trees!

It’s interesting you mention silver polishing- we had that as an activity one night as part of an “old fashioned skills” thing and the kids (especially the 7-10yos) LOVED it!! Ditto when we taught them how to make proper cups of tea! My experience is that parents tend to want/expect a lot of flashy risky outdoors things, but the kids just want novelty and fun and a sense of accomplishment. 

 

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MerryMadrigalMadge

My DD11 is in Scouts, this will be her 4th year in Cubs/Scouts.

 

she loves it, it’s cheap, it’s local, it’s physical, stimulating and very social. She is an only child, so I love that she has this weekly opportunity to be loud and physical , rough and tumble a bit. 
 

Scout activities are also very child led - she is in a leadership role this year and there’s a lot of speaking in a group, finding your voice, kind of discussions.
 

she has her fingers crossed to be involved in a Showtime performance next year, and I’m thinking of volunteering to be a leader if she commits to another year.

we did try guides but as PP’s have mentioned, you just luck out with leaders - our local girl guides were just not we wanted, they were very craft centred, not a lot of physicality. 

 

 

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seayork2002
1 hour ago, MsLaurie said:

It depends a lot on the local leaders. I think in general Guides (at an organisational level) has a lower appetite for risk than Scouts, but not significantly.

But what mix of risky activities each unit does depends on local preferences. My unit, for example, doesn’t do a huge amount of camping as our leadership team don’t have much weekend availability. But we do build rope bridges between trees!

It’s interesting you mention silver polishing- we had that as an activity one night as part of an “old fashioned skills” thing and the kids (especially the 7-10yos) LOVED it!! Ditto when we taught them how to make proper cups of tea! My experience is that parents tend to want/expect a lot of flashy risky outdoors things, but the kids just want novelty and fun and a sense of accomplishment. 

 

Ds and I planned a old fashioned games night, we had marbles, quiots, hop scotch and a couple of others I have gone blank on the kids seemed to like it

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amdirel
3 hours ago, MadMarchMasterchef said:

Does guides these days do as much of the outdoor activities as scouts?    I was a guide as a kid and found the activities unrelateable ( eg polishing silverware when I was from a very low income family)  and I switched to scouts because they had more hiking and camping.   That was nearly 40 years ago though so i assume its a lot more modern now. 

I don't have any experience with guides really, but I must say when we see them at camps, they tend to have hand sewn and embroidered mess kit bags, a hand sewn group banner, sometimes bunting around their site, etc. So they evidently are doing a fair bit of 'ladies activities'. 

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Meepy

My daughter is in guides and they do a large variety of things.  Orienteering, horse riding, camp craft, cooking, escape rooms, games, canoeing, service activities e.g. with the RSL on Anzac Day, Australia Day parade, AFL matches carrying flags for some multicultural celebration, baking and having a stall for the lost dogs home, fundraising for charity etc.  They do crafts with a focus e.g. making a dilly bag for their next camp, creating banners etc, presents for mothers/fathers days/Easter/Christmas.  

The group is mostly girl led - at the start of each term they decide what to do.  We've been having zoom meetings from the start of Term 2 and they've had virtual camps, including one with a group in England they are connected with.  They run quizzes, escape rooms, yoga sessions etc. so even with limitations they are creative.  The girl guides organisation has Friday night virtual get togethers with inspirational female leaders in different fields and varying areas of focus.  They have also produced girl guide TV- half an hour each week showing different skills and activities.  Fantastic organisation that has really helped girls stay connected during the pandemic.  One of the best places to learn independence and resilience as they are treated with respect and expectations are high, but not in a way that makes them feel like they fail if they don't get things right.  

I did guides when I was young and there was much more focus on ironing your uniform, polishing your badges - that has not occurred in the 6 years that DD has been in brownies/guides.

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MadMarchMasterchef
5 hours ago, Meepy said:

My daughter is in guides and they do a large variety of things....

Thats great to hear, sounds like a fabulous group! 

 

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Elsegundo

I'm a joey scout leader so biased but I think scouts are great. The leaders in our Group are so committed and put in so much time. What I love about it is that kids get say in what they do, there are opportunities for outdoor adventures that we normally would not have found like obstacle courses, flying foxes and abseiling, and everyone is accepted for what they want to do. Some love badges and work really hard on them, and there are lots of opportunities for that,  but others just come along each week and have fun without doing the extra. My kid with ASD is accepted in the group though he hardly speaks. We tried lots of different things before we found scouts. That's why I become a leader - this is a group I want to support. 

Oops costs. Ours is about $140 a term plus extra for weekend events like camps (but kept as low as possible). Now it's free until term 2 2021 and we've been running online during shut down (in Melbourne). 

Edited by Elsegundo
Added costs info
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**Tiger*Filly**

My daughter has been in Scouts since she was 10 and a half and has enjoyed it. Been on lots of camps, went to Jamboree. I haven’t done a lot of parent helper stuff and nor has DH. 
DD is now 14 and has just quit because her friends from Scouts have all now moved up to venturers and she doesn’t want to do that.

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MsLaurie
6 hours ago, amdirel said:

I don't have any experience with guides really, but I must say when we see them at camps, they tend to have hand sewn and embroidered mess kit bags, a hand sewn group banner, sometimes bunting around their site, etc. So they evidently are doing a fair bit of 'ladies activities'. 

Not to derail, but there really is nothing wrong with kids learning these skills and enjoying them. Arts and crafts are useful, and teach patience, persistence, and reward you with something tangible. Just because something is coded traditionally feminine doesn’t mean it’s bad or a waste of time.

* steps off girly things are feminist too soapbox *

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amdirel
1 hour ago, MsLaurie said:

Not to derail, but there really is nothing wrong with kids learning these skills and enjoying them. Arts and crafts are useful, and teach patience, persistence, and reward you with something tangible. Just because something is coded traditionally feminine doesn’t mean it’s bad or a waste of time.

* steps off girly things are feminist too soapbox *

There was no need to get in your soapbox in the first place. I did not say that art and craft is bad.

I'm pretty much the artiest and craftiest person I know. I do a lot of art and craft. Well, at least I used to, pre-kids!

But PP and every other person I have this discussion with, want to know if guides = less adventure, more craft. I was just sharing my thoughts.

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MsLaurie

It was the term “ladies activities” that caught my eye and bothered me a bit, hence soapbox. But it doesn’t matter. Both organisations are good, and fun, and teach useful skills - both adventurous and less so. 

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Fifteenyears

I’ve seen a fair amount of craft over the years in cubs and scouts.   No needlework (apart from sewing on badges, which kids are encouraged to do themselves),  but screen printing, tie dye, various paper craft activities, beadwork, woggle making of many different types, building billy carts, pairing up with the local men’s shed to build possum boxes after the bushfires, and so on.

Edited by Fifteenyears
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amdirel
4 minutes ago, MsLaurie said:

It was the term “ladies activities” that caught my eye and bothered me a bit, hence soapbox. But it doesn’t matter. Both organisations are good, and fun, and teach useful skills - both adventurous and less so. 

There was a reason I put it in inverted commas.

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Elsegundo

We do so much craft in joey scouts! 

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luke's mummu
On 17/10/2020 at 10:09 PM, Fifteenyears said:

I’ve seen a fair amount of craft over the years in cubs and scouts.   No needlework (apart from sewing on badges, which kids are encouraged to do themselves),  but screen printing, tie dye, various paper craft activities, beadwork, woggle making of many different types, building billy carts, pairing up with the local men’s shed to build possum boxes after the bushfires, and so on.

Our son used a sewing machine in cubs to make their own mess kit. I think a fair bit of adult assistance happened as well! 

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seayork2002

That is why I like scouts because ds has done a wide variety of things, craft, physical, safety, water based, ropes, camp fires , tent building there is not much I can think of he hasn't done

Not trying to compare it to guides as I have no knowledge of guides

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literally nobody

So Ds1 & Dd are having a trial at Scouts on Thursday evening., totally excited here! I think it’s great hearing all the activities they do, I think it would do them the world of good, plus very reasonably priced, I pay for so many extra curricular activities-  this is so much more affordable. 

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ContentedFleur

I was a Brownie Guide, Girl Guide, & Ranger GUide. Loved it.

For various reasons, neither of my kids went into the Guide/Scouts. However:

1. How would Scouts go with a 9 yo ADHD ASD lad?
2. Is 13 too old to start Guides? 

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literally nobody
9 minutes ago, ContentedFleur said:

I was a Brownie Guide, Girl Guide, & Ranger GUide. Loved it.

For various reasons, neither of my kids went into the Guide/Scouts. However:

1. How would Scouts go with a 9 yo ADHD ASD lad?
2. Is 13 too old to start Guides? 

I have read this morning on a article that girl guides go to 17. 
Im also curious how scouts and ASD/ADHD mix, my youngest boy is 8 and he has been refused in many activities due to his temperament and lack of listening skills etc.

Edited by literally nobody

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MsLaurie
35 minutes ago, ContentedFleur said:


2. Is 13 too old to start Guides? 

I’ve had a couple of new-to-Guides join at 12, 13, 14. It’s reasonably rare but it does happen. Those girls have turned into some of my keenest members! Just be sure that the relevant unit has a few kids in the age group (some units say they have older girls but it’s like one kid that’s stuck around!)  and it should be great!

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