I had a very positive birth experience with my DD. I recently posted my own birth story in the birth stories thread because I wanted to share with other women that sometimes it does go well. I have been so saddened lately by reading about all the traumatic birth stories (if you have posted one, thank you for sharing, you are brave and have my utmost admiration). I have also noticed lots of threads where women are asking here on EB if a midwife would explain why such and such happened.

While I had a great experience I would have really appreciated a de-brief after the birth, there is still stuff that I don't quite understand/remember and would have liked someone to explain. I can only imagine that if somebody had a traumatic experience then not knowing why x, y and z happened to them would only add to the trauma.

But after my baby was born I was in the newborn haze of breastfeeding and sleep deprivation, and I completely forgot to ask!

Do any hospitals make a point of going over the birth with women afterward? Is it a case that women don't generally want to talk about it because they're too focused on their babies? Is it a staffing/resource issue? Is there anyone out there in EB land who knows the answers to these questions?

For my next I will make a point of pinning down the midwife who looks after me during labour/birth and getting her to go over it with me.

Anyway, just some thoughts.

I totally agree with you. I think a debrief should be offered to ANYONE involved in ANY procedure in hospital.

My twins birth was a horrible experience and I was left with nerve damage...some sort of debrief, what to expect next, this is what happened would have been great!

I had a debriefing immediately following my birth from the obs and the midwife in charge and another a day or two later by the obs again. They made a specific point of coming to see me in my room and giving me an information booket and making sure I knew why xyz happened.

This was with my DS, when I had moderate shoulder dystocia which was an emergency situation (I.e babies die from it) luckily my DS is fine and the debriefing was very useful.

I had a brief debrief from the midwife on duty with my DD (complication free).

Both were in a public hospital.

There are some women who have multiple questions immediately post birth and others who are not in the head space to think about what has happened until days or weeks later.
I would always encourage everyone to ask for explanations because often it is really hard for the midwife to preempt there is a problem that needs debriefing about unless something is mentioned.
Occasionally there is obviously something troubling mum and I have always taken the initiative to ask if there is something she needs to talk about.
For myself I found that my debrief was delayed until I got pregnant again when I was suddenly thinking about the possibility of a repeat performance.

If you have a private Obstsetrician be sure that you don't go home unless you have asked him/her to explain anything that you feel unsure or unsettled about. It beats trying to deal with it once home with a new baby, sleep deprivation etc.

My first 2 were born in a different hospital to my 3rd. With my 3rd I got a debrief, my first and second I didn't. Maybe it's just a hospital policy thing.

Before discharge with my third my ob came to me and went through the birth. She asked if I understood why A, B and C needed to be done, if I had any questions and if I wanted to talk to anyone. He was emergency C/S a 32 weeks due to pre-eclampsia related liver failure and I spent 3 days in ICU.

I wish I had this debreif with my first two children. My second was an emergency C/S in the middle of the night without labour due to pre-eclamptic seizures. I had already been in hospital for 3.5 weeks. Then my baby was flown to Brisbane so I didn't see him, (or my husband because he went too) for 4 days. A debrief would have been great.

Having my first baby (induced natural drug free birth) was absolutely horrendous but not much to speak of in the way of complications apart from 3rd degree tear. I would still have benefited though from going over it with someone as I still have questions to this day.

This is a very good idea for the hospital suggestions box!!

Edited to tidy up any identifying info on eB.

We had debrief with ob and midwife not long after delivery (a few hours) whilst still in the birth suite, then a few days later the midwife came to our room and debriefed again. Ob visited everyday, sometimes twice a day, so plenty of talk about delivery, then final debrief at 6 week checkup. This has been the same with both deliveries. Wonderful care.

Unlike other more rough and tumble areas of EB I have found that the birth stories forum is generally a safe and supportive space for anyone who has chosen to share their story. I find that the sub-forums do tend to be a softer place to land and that criticism or insensitivity is not tolerated in the same way it may be in other areas of EB. I can't blame you for being apprehensive though. I've seen some doozies in my time here

One option is to get your medical records from the hospital and go through them with a 3rd party like an independent midwife or doctor. I went through mine with a midwife a year after DD's birth and it was incredibly useful.

Pookems85 that might be useful for you....

All three of my boys were born in the same publi hospital and I had the same type of antenatal care (community midwife program). With my first, I became sick and was induced. One of the midwifes came and spoke with me the next day about my labour, kinda an unofficial de-brief. With my other two boys, the labours were straight forward with no complications and I don't think I really needed a de-brief.

I think it's a great idea even for people that don't really have questions or a bad experience. I had 3 wonderful straight forward births and didn't really have any questions about any of what happened, but I still felt the need to talk about it a lot. The intimate details of birth aren't always things you can talk to all of your friends about. It is a huge event both physically and emotionally and I think it is something a lot of women could benefit from.

I wish I had been able to debrief after my birth, it would have made things easier down the track. My OB only came to see me once in hospital afterwards for about 5 minutes, and the postnatal midwives were always busy and never referred to the birth so I didn't exactly feel encouraged to bring it up. I felt there was this attitude that once the birth is over it is past history and there is no point discussing it.

I think we need to make it priority to help women debrief after birth. If someone has a traumatic birth they are much more likely to develop PND and this is made worse if you feel that you cannot talk about it. The contribution of birth trauma to PND is vastly under-acknowledged IMO.



Yes totally, I haven't written my birth story here but in one thread I did mention something the OB did which was very traumatic and felt like assault only to be told by someone who was not there that it must have been necessary. That was like a punch in the stomach.

Great topic OP.

I have just finished my Diploma in Childbirth Education and have started a counselling diploma to address this exact issue. I would like to offer my clients the a post birth debrief included as part of their Childbirth Education. Even after my positive birth, I really wanted to tell someone all about it. The midwives are busy, and most visitors are not really that interested.

Becoming a parent is a life changing moment, and while there is support there for the day to day things on the most part (e.g. breast feeding) I think that having someone to talk to women after their birth and beyond if necessary would make a big difference to a lot of women. It might help to identify those at risk of PND too. As part of my course I am going to offer counselling to patients in the public hospital here for post birth. I think it would make a big difference. I think that sometimes it will help to have someone there for the woman, to discuss her feelings and experience.

I am so sorry to those who have had negative birth experiences and felt that they cannot share it for whatever reason. Sometimes writing it down can be very helpful, so I would encourage anyone to do that, even if no one else reads it. Trauma is always in the eye of the beholder, what one person finds traumatic, another won't, it does not lessen the impact for the person involved.. If anyone needs a empathetic set of eyes, I am always happy to help, please feel free to PM me.

I think it would be helpful for a lot of mums.

Maybe it should be part of the 6 wk check-up. Going over the physical and mental concerns (or scars!) after the birth. I'd say that 6 wks post birth a new mum has had time to digest the events and her feelings etc and have that list of questions and queries.

There are services out there that have popped up to help mums, but mums tend to have to search hard to find them etc.

A friend of mine had a really HORRIBLE birth. She suffered depression prior to pregnancy. It was her actively finding appropriate care through BirthTalk ( in QLD) that helped her move on from her experience and (years later) enable her to consider another pregnancy.

http://www.birthtalk.org/BirthWasntGreat.html

I fully agree.

I know I had a straight forward delivery with DD3 but I still wanted to know what happened when. 3 days after delivery, I asked the ward nurse to get my chart and tell me a few details - she couldn't answer all my questions but I felt so much better.

I still have questions about DD1's birth, but it was interstate and it's too late.

I'm so sorry for those of you who have had traumatic experiences, I would encourage you to either to see your caregiver or get the hospital notes and go through it with someone who can interpret.

Edited to tidy up any identifying info on eB.

pookems, please don't ever think that you didn't do a good enough job.

ETA.. I think everyone should be able to have a 'de-brief'. My first birth was horrid and I wanted help but felt like I wouldn't be listened to. Second birth was easy but it still would have been nice to talk about it.

Sounds so familiar pookems85. I have so many questions still also and it was 7months ago now. I actually obtained my medical records and there is so much incomplete stuff and the ob's handwriting is unreadable , it could say anything. I didn't have questions during my short stay. I was so exhausted I just wanted to go home as I wasn't getting any rest in the hospital. When the ob and midwives dropped in the day after the birth I had had only 1/2hour sleep in the previous 50+ hours and was still coming down of the morphine from a spinal and elated in my little man that all was 'hunky dory' at that moment.

I know what you mean about feeling like you shouldn't put your birth story in, I had my dad (my dad seriously!) tell me that I had actually had a pretty good birth and I should be happy when I tried to voice how upset I felt about certain things.

Fortunately it hasn't stopped me wanting another child. But DP will be on strict instruction about being a hard @r$e on the labour day and I will definitely be 'one of those' patients and refusing certain things so long as I am able.




The six week mark would probably be ideal. It would need to be with a midwife or the OB, I think as I didn't see much point discussing with my GP as I doubt they could answer questions to the detail I need.


OP I have heard somewhere on EB I think, that it's part of the birthing experience to have a debriefing session in the UK. Shame it's not here.

edit: to add missing word.

Agreed! This should be offered as part of everyone's care.

Pookems - of course you did a good enough job. If you feel that your DP thinks that, that needs to be talked about. If he won't talk about it with you, that makes it difficult. He should talk about it with you. Sounds like you're both maybe a bit traumatised by the experience and could probably both benefit from talking to someone about it, but that you're at the point of realising that and he isn't. I don't know what you can do about him, but for you, you can seek out a kind ear. Go to your GP and ask to be assessed for PND & ask for a referral to a counsellor. Often you can see one for free through a GP. Also, if you feel that something that happened during the birth was assault, then it was. If something was done to you without your consent that is assault. Regardless of whether it was necessary consent still needs to be obtained for any procedure.

I was musing on that earlier tonight. I had my DD 4 weeks ago and the birth was not a positive experience as DS' had been. We had planned a home birth but ended up being induced in hospital at 42 weeks. It was absurdly busy that day and I didn't even get my own room until an hour before DD was born. In fact, it was so busy that I was one of 4 women who needed the room so they wanted to assess all of us to see who was the furthest along & who should get the room. A very bossy midwife who I hadn't met before came in & wanted to do a VE for this reason. I was in the thick of hardcore contractions coming fast & couldn't contemplate having a VE at that point so I was asking is this necessary? Do we need to do this now? while kneeling over a chair having contractions. We had our IM (independent midwife) there with us as birth support. The hospital midwife must have been leaning in to just do the VE anyway even though we hadn't finished talking about it & I hadn't given consent as our IM, who is very lovely and soft and mild mannered practically shouted "ARE YOU GOING TO GET PERMISSION FOR THAT VE?". So the hospital midwife backed off and started talking to me again. I was just musing before on what would have happened if my IM hadn't stepped in then. I think I would have felt assaulted if she'd done the VE then without my permission.

Wow I'm sorry to read so many people had terrible experiences and got no answers.

Obtaining medical records is fairly simple, can you ring the hospital and speak to a patient liaison about going over your records? Or take them to your GP? If people went private, make an appointment with your ob to go over them? I think it is so important to understand what went on and go over your birthig experience, both good and bad points.

Green thumbs - it is standard where I birthed, and with my obstetrician. Maybe something worth enquiring about when people make hospital choices? I'm sure it would be standard in many hospitals?

Definately this is needed. I still have so many questions about DS's birth and DH simply can't recall everything so he isn't much help. My OB was there but only toward the end, and while she is lovely I haven't felt really ok to just open up and verbally express everything I felt and went through.

I have however had a lovely friend from my DIG who we've been able to chat ona nd off over the last 12 months about our births, sometimes its just a matter of getting it off your chest as well about what happeend - even if it wasn't traumatic as such.

My first son almost died during birth (shoulder dystocia, not breathing, needed resuscitation). I requested a debrief a few days after he was born (once he had stabilised in the NICU where the NETS ambulance took him). It was awful. Pretty much just the hospital backpeddling and trying to avoid saying anything that might in any way suggest they could be liable for the 'result' (their words). It was an awful experience for me. However fortunately for me, I had a sort of 'debrief' after that horrible debrief with a senior midwife at the hospital where the NICU was (she saw me return from the official debrief in tears and took me aside for a chat). Even though she hadn't been there she was able to explain to me in more detail about what had happened. It wasn't until this chat with her that I understood that what had happened during the birth was not my fault (I was convinced prior to that chat that I was to blame because I was tired and didn't push hard enough). Of course the birth experience still haunts me (my son has cerebral palsy as a result) but to this day I am so incredibly grateful to that midwife for her kind, thoughtful, intelligent words. I don't think she could possibly have known how much it meant to me.

So yes, in short. Absolutely agree. Not just in cases as clearly horrible as ours, but in all situations. Debriefs should be encouraged and even promoted. Giving birth is a huge deal and I bet lots of women would benefit from understanding a bit more about what happened during their labour. But they should definitely be conducted in a caring, considerate manner.

your GP may be someone you can de-brief with after birth at the 6 week check - in my state we now get a detailed mum and baby summary that could be walked through. If they don't have enough info, then getting a copy of your notes and going through them either with your ob or Gp or midwife could be helpful - but sometimes especially if there is an emergency, these might not contain as many details as you would like.
I would like to recommend a "Calmbirth" course prior to delivery, especially if you have had concerns from your previous one. It's a great opportunity to work through fears and come up with ways to deal with them, and I found it helped reveal fears I didn't realise I still had that probably impacted subsequent labours...I and I can recommend this even though my last delivery was my most traumatic and I only did one day of the 2 day course because I went into labour at 30 weeks the end of that first day!

Having the chance to de-brief is really important.

I was lucky with DD2 in that I had several people to debrief with (repeatedly) after the birth (husband, doula, OB) and an offer from the midwife too. Several of the postnatal ward staff wanted to come in and talk to me about it too, which I was fine with doing.

A lot of people expressed surprise that I wasn't more upset about how things worked out (severe shoulder dystocia, DD2 born with an APGAR of 1 and requiring help to start breathing etc). Don't get me wrong, I'm not dismissing the seriousness of the situation, but I knew straight away just how lucky DD2 was. Relief and gratitude far outweighed any trauma with regard to her birth.

DD1's birth by scheduled c-section was more traumatising to me than DD2's birth, but in the haze of first time motherhood (plus dealing with a dreadful post CS internal infection, then side effects of the medication I was on to treat the infection for me and for DD1, dealing with painful longterm breastfeeding issues and having to move house on top of all of that) the negative feelings didn't fully sink in until a couple of months later - well after the 6 week check up when I found myself smiling and nodding at the OB and his stupid comments. A month or so later I was furious with myself for doing that. If there was a chance to have an official de-briefing session I'm not sure how a specific time frame would be decided, personally speaking I don't think 6 weeks post-birth is long enough and many other women I have spoken to have voiced similar opinions.

Debriefing can be a really, really good thing. Yes, it can be painful to dig up those memories, feelings and thoughts again, but dealing with them is so much better than bottling them up. Getting hold of hospital records can be really useful. I found writing about my experiences was also really cathartic, so I'd also highly recommend that to anyone who is trying to process their feelings and thoughts. I also want to say to previous posters who have expressed reservation about revealing their thoughts about their birth experience/s - noone else experienced the birth/s the way you did, so don't let anyone try to dismiss or invalidate your feelings. You feel how you feel, and you shouldn't have to justify that to anyone. We can be so hard on ourselves. Go gently.

I would have liked more information after #1. I didn't like that was given ice blocks that actually HURT to sit on and didn't know WHY I was in so much pain.

until a midwife was checking something and I ventured a question and she informed me "Well, you are black down there" very matter of factly.

WHO KNEW?!?!?!?!?!

I couldn't sit to feed and was told off by the SCN nurse for not wanting to hold DD1 during her bath and refusing to sit in a chair to feed less than 24 hours post birth. Maybe if I'd known why I was in so much pain I could have stood up to her a bit more. As it was I just began avoiding SCN because I didn't like her.

The OB was very available for questions etc but I didn't know what I was asking and tbh once my duds were back on and he wasn't looking down there anymore I didn't want to talk to him about 'down there'.

Weird.

I'm a postgrad mid student who has been on the ward for about 3 weeks now. I make a point of creating an opening for the parents to talk about their birth experience - not formally but dropping a casual line into conversation. No one ever talked me through my birth with DD and its something I feel strongly about.

I completely agree. I felt the birth of DD3 was very traumatic compared to the first two. She got stuck because hand was coming out with her shoulders as well as my uterus being too tired to contract anymore due to having contractions that never went down at all and having an irritable uterus in the weeks leading up the the birth.

At the time I knew none of this but kept having nightmares about the pushing stage the next night - so much so that I pulled my catheter and drip out of my arm(for PPH) in the middle of them.

The next day my Dr saw that I was still visibly shaken from it so he got the midwife who looked after me to come and give me a debrief. This is where I found out what happened and that it was a more traumatic birth than my other two. The debrief for me was critical and I felt so much better after hearing my midwife - who was AWESOME say that she hadnt seen many like that one before. I really feel that it is why I got over it so quickly. I appreciated the time she took to come and talk to me especially since she was busy and had clocked off.

I think perhaps first time mums as well as traumatic births would particularly benefit from that practice.

Perhaps 2 or 3 hours before I went home from hospital I was given a debrief. It should have been by the attending midwife, but she wasn't available, so I had another midwife go through it with me, all the details, what happened, did I have any questions. She then typed it all up and about a week after I got home, I got the "Meeting Minutes" in the mail.

Edited to add: I had a quick easy birth, but debrief is the norm at our local hospital. Also, didn't know that DD had the cord around her neck twice until the debrief!

I just want to thank PPs for validating my feelings, and giving me some tools going forward. I am going to ask for my hospital notes. Thank you.

Hey,

The traumatic birth board is actually a really supportive place to write your story down. You get the odd EB-idiot who comes in to say something stupid, but 99% of the responses are very supportive.

I found it very helpful to speak with other women about my birth. My DH hates talking about it and it can be really lonely if you don't have anyone you can really vent to about what happened.

My birth was awful, but possibly the worst bit was when the midwife was elbow deep inside me trying to stick a clip on DS's head and the (#&# #)$*)$# cow was joking with the OB...I have never felt like such a piece of useless meat. Luckily the OB saw this and removed her (from my insides and the room)...I still get flash-backs. DH doesn't understand, he didn't even notice this going on!