BOOK CLUB FORMAT

• All welcome - jump in anytime!
• Books chosen at beginning of the year. 2010 Reading list.
• One month to read the book.
• Discussion welcome throughout the month (in this thread) but please prefix your post with a *warning* if you want to discuss anything that might expose the plot to other members.
• The last week of each month: Discussion questions posted for reply. Whoever chose that book for the month, is responsible for posting questions.

Finished this one a few days ago, but will wait for others before a launch into anything.

I'm dying to know what the rest of you think of this one.

Jo

I have been absent for the last copule of months But im ahead and have also read this one ...Yay!!!!!

I'll try and get a copy this week from the library. Hopefully it is a good read!

Liking the lightness of this one so far ... guessing that may change with the "desperate and chilling course of action" ...

About to submit my last uni assignment, and then will get stuck into it to finish it.

Found an audio copy Will pick it up on Wednesday.

Siouxie, I'd be interested to hear what you think of the audio version. I imgaine different narrators could really alter your opinion on this particular book.

Yes definately

I probably would've struggled through Joy Dettman's 'Pearl in A Cage' were it not for Deidre Rubenstein's narration. She really gave life to every one of those characters, and I probably wouldn't have warmed to many of them otherwise. Very talented actress/narrator

Looking forward to this month's book!

I've got this one from the library. Hopefully get to start it this weekend. Sounds intriguing!

Kate

Finished ... very thought provoking.

I agree that the audio version could make it a very different story, depending on the tone and inflection of the narrator.

Looking forward to reading some discussion on this one.

Ok, I'm struggling with this one

Maybe it's the narration, not sure, but I'm finding the main character to be completely unlikeable and boring. It's so depressing and bland, with nothing but small talk and everyday observations. I keep waiting for an interesting plot to emerge... He's at the boarding house, and his Mother has visited ect... I'm just not warming to any of the characters or the story at this point.

Am I missing something here?

Thank god you said that Siouxie, that is exactly how I found the first half of the book - and the writing is just so pedestrian. However, I did find I enjoyed the second half a bit more after the incident and the repercussions of that. I'll be interested to see what you think about the second half - though the depressing part doesn't change much.

Jo

Thanks J-lo, I'll persevere

Agree about the writing ("pedestrian", love it ).

Oh Phew. Thought it was just me! I started this last night and found it quite depressing reading. I will keep going though, as it does seem an easy read, if not very interesting yet???

Is there something not quite 'right' about the protagonist? To me, it seems he's portrayed as not quite understanding social communication, body language, etc. Perhaps Autistic?

Kate

Yeh I'd wondered that too ... something doesn't add up with him. So far I've chalked it down to possible depression?

I agree the protagonist is definitely NQR - he reactions are at times completely over the top, the inner dialogue he has with himself is irrational. Like the rest of the story this does get better in the second half of the story, though his justification of the incident never leaves the irrational camp - I won't discuss the actual incident until a few more have finished.

Well, this might not have been the most enjoyable read, but it has generated a little bit of interesting discussion already.

Jo

I'm only half way through and finding it difficult to get into it. The 'incident' has happened but not much else. I truly believe that the main character has some kind of personality disorder, just not pegged it down yet (not that it probably matters).

The one thing that I am really finding difficult to marry up is that this is a british novel yet it doesn't seem to invoke the same kind of atmosphere/characters as a typical british novel. I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad thing just yet! Am still working that out.

Anyway, I will keep going with it. Am glad that I wasn't the only one struggling with this one!

I did have to chuckle at the oh-so-very-"british" names of the characters.

I kept waiting for more to emerge on just what his personality disorder was, because there is certainly something not quite right!

OK, I finished this last night.

A few things that made me think. No spoilers in here - just general observations I hope!

In the first half of the book, it is very obvious that he doesn't fit in. All the conversations, and interactions with other people are awkward. You can really feel the silences, and the lack of connection he has with people. It does make me think of someone on the Autism spectrum. Especially how he is seen as quite intelligent (going to university), his knowledge on particular subjects (cars) and his obsessions with things (tool box). I think he drinks a lot because in makes interacting with people a bit smoother. It's as though reading peoples body language, tone of voice, facial expressions etc, doesn't come naturally to him at all. There is one comment, I can't remember if it was about Bridget or Georgia, where he says something like "She smiles. She wants me to think she's happy." And also with the boss at the car garage. "He puts his arm across the doorway. It's the kind of thing a man does when he wants you to know he's in charge." It's as though he's constantly trying to work people out, and he has no instinct about it. He's just adding up all the things they say vs what they do.

The 2nd half of the book though, I found the interactions he had with other people didn't seem so stilted. Once he was in prison, with such set rules and regulations, and everyone had a place, and he knew what everyone's roles were (even researching the different types of prisoners and working out what sort of prisoner he was), he was much more comfortable. It made me think about people who prefer to be in prison, or who keep committing crimes so they can go back to prison because that is the only place they feel they fit in, and belong.

I've got a few other things I've thought about too, but I'll wait until everyone has finished in case I spoil anything. I found the end a bit abrupt, until I thought about it a bit more...

Kate

I have finished as well.

I'm not really sure what to think. At the end I kind of felt that it was pointless. It really didn't go anywhere. Mind you I guess that the ending was pretty much the point where the rest of his life was heading but I guess I was expecting more or something!

I'm up to about chapter 22, and am finding it a little more engaging. A major clue for me, was when the guard was asking Patrick to repeat himself, after hearing him mutter something. Patrick was talking to himself about having a long hot shower with loads of soap, and the guard heard and asked if he regularly spoke to himself (and then quoted what he said). Patrick denied saying anything aloud. So he's certainly suffering some sort of mental illness, and I'm curious to find out more.

The audio narration is pretty good, especially now that he's in prison and all the unsavoury characters are given life (ie Stevenson, and the QC ect).

Also, the first person narrative really helps - and provides some insight into this guys mind. I don't think the novel would work otherwise.

Interested to see where the story goes from here on ...

Hi All,

I've been on the hunt for some questions, but haven't found any online for this one. Anyone else got any, ot maybe just a discussion topic/idea of out own.

I did find this discussion of the book from the ABC's First Tuesday Book Club which I though you might be interested in.

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/firsttuesday/s2682931.htm

I thought it was quite interesting, they seemed to get more out of this one than I did. I tended to agree mainly with Di Morrissey - what about you?

Jo

Hi j-lo,

I'm on the last disc now, and will finish it tonight. Will check out that link tomorrow and comment

I can see why they said what they did in that interview Jo, but I must admit it really didn't affect me the same way. I'm still thinking it was all a bit blah frankly. I don't think I will remember this book, just couldn't really get it or the character. Oh well! Don't believe it was a waste of time reading it though!

Oops, after reading the transcript of that episode (First Tuesday BC), I feel a little ignorant now. Being so closely compared to The Stranger, it should've been a book that I liked Perhaps I've totally missed the point.

Not all books are for everyone though, which is cool. This is what I love about book clubs - the differing opinions and insights.

At the end of the story, I just didn't care enough about Patrick to wonder. For his fate behind bars, his relationship with his parents, or for the supposed complexities of his mental health. I'm not left with any lingering thoughts about it really. For a book's premise to be some sort of insightful peek-a-boo into the mind of a killer... it just left me with the boring assumption that perhaps ordinary, everyday people commit random murder, with no apparent psychological reasons behind it? I did perk up a little when he began the appointments with the psychologist, but even that proved fruitless (unless I missed something there)? He sounded depressed and insular in his thoughts, but nothing outwardly dark or complex.

I have a question though for everyone: As a parent, how do you think you'd cope with your child in this predicament? It'd be impossible to know without experience of course, but did you imagine how you'd be (in terms of visiting, forgiveness ect)?

I think in order to forgive I'd have to understand, which would drive me to investigate the mental health of my child, not giving up until I had the answers. I found Patrick's parents reaction rather vacant, and expected them to at least respond a bit after he had been in there for a while?

It was strange - are we meant to believe that most murderers are as laid-back, almost neutral (rather than committed in hatred or anger) as this one? Like "oops, look what happened"? Sorry, but I am not buying that. I just more and more thought that there was going to be some great revelation about his mental health and/or behavioural disorder, but it never came.

I think that was the only thought-provoking part of this book once I was finished - not wondering what would become of him in gaol, but more still thinking about what his "problem" was, because he was not an "everyday" guy in his social interactions, and the way his thought processes worked.

I agree there wasn't too much lingering thought for me either, I didn't hate the book but I certainly don't get what was so brilliant about it either. I also thought there could be some kind on interesting connection made between Patrick and the psychologist, but he really didn't say anything of substance to her at all.

What I did think was rather interesting was the way the author told the story exclusively from Patrick's perspective. I think that would be quite unusual in novels, in most books I think you get at least a glimpse into some of the other characters lives.

Siouxie, interesting question. As you say it's probably something you really can't say how you'd handle until you're in that position, but I like to think I would have reacted very differently from the Oxtoby's. If my child had the strained social interactions that Patrick did, I would be especially worried about their well-being in gaol - although that environment seemed to agree with Patrick. I'd also like to think that I could find it in myself to forgive and to love despite the actions of my child. In Patrick's case he was not a violent psychopath, but a naive socially-inadequate boy, I'd be feeling pretty guilty as a parent that his life came to what it did. Instead of being protected and nurtured by his parents, he was ostricised and kept at a distance, particularly by his father.

It was, in fact, the parents of Patrick's victim that showed him the most compassion, something I thought might have been explored a little more by the author. I really don't understand Patrick's parents and their decision to emigrate after his trial - talk about abandoning your child in their time of need. He did an awful thing, but he was still their child.

Anyway, that's my two cents.
Jo

I think his "thriving" in the structured gaol environment is one of the more thought-provoking aspects of the story. It speaks volumes about his personality "disorder" or whatever it may be, to me.

What do others think?

Thanks for the link. That was really interesting to listen to that discussion.

I thought that at the end of the book, it was as though he was finally 'home'. He was in a safe place, where he could predict the world around him and he knew his role in it. He always felt so removed from everything, as though he was just an observer, and he didn't really 'feel' anything. But at the end of the book, in prison, he began to have some more meaningful relationships with people who were more similar to him.

I also thought the physical affection between him and the warden, and the other inmates was strange at first. But after reading the book, I thought that perhaps it is more that it is something we all crave, and need. I don't think he got much affection shown to him from his family. The fact that they are more worried about themselves after the act, than him, screams volumes about their relationship with him. It was like there was no connection. No love. Especially from his father. I think his father was very similar to Patrick. In that he didn't fit into, and understand the world.

I'm not sure about his Mum though. Her following him at the start, and worrying about him. It was like she didn't believe he could survive on his own. She knew of his deficiencies and is lack of understanding of the world, and felt she had to continue to protect him. But he was a grown man so she had to let him go??

I wondering if his relationship (was it Sarah?) was more of a mother/son relationship - with her caring for him. And maybe his mother felt comfortable knowing someone else was looking after him.

I think if I was a parent in the same situation, you would, of course, be incredibly confused, hurt, disappointed in your son. But over riding all that would be the love of your son - unconditionally, and you would be that support for them throughout it all. You'd be saying, "Yes, you did the wrong thing. And yes, you'll be punished for it. But I will still love you, and visit you, and do everything i can for you, because you are my son."

Kate.

Yes I agree about his need for physical affection having arose from a detached childhood. His parents not being available for him ect... Didn't really think about that aspect, but now that you mention it PB. And yes it would most likely explain his smooth transition to prison life, with his acceptance to routine and order - he was such a fragile personality that throughout life he needed to be guided as he didn't know or trust himself enough.

Thanks to whoever chose the book this month, I'm grateful to have read it (even though I didn't love it) Definately food for thought and discussion!

Anyone looked at July's book yet?

I agree Siouxie, it has been an interesting read with a great discussion and I am glad that I did perservere with it in the end.

Looked up the July book on the library catelogue, but haven't yet got a copy, I need to get them to transfer it from one of the other branches. I notices it's a biography which will be different again from any of the other books we've read so far.

I was thinking now that we've read half the year's books we should do a poll, best and worst of the books so far. What do others think?

Jo

Great idea! What does everyone else think?

My copy of July's book is still sitting here, I've yet to find the time to pick it up.... am hoping to make a start this week though. A biography will be a nice change

I love biographies! I've got the next one on hold at the library. Hopefully shouldn't take too long.

I think that's a great idea. I've only read the last 3, but would love to hear what everyone elses favourite book has been.

Kate

Got my copy of the July book coming into the library tomorrow - though I won't be able to pick it up until Wednesday. Looking forward to a biography too. The librarian was saying it was written by the same person who wrote The Bride Stripped Bare - any read that one?

Okay for the poll:

Equal favs for me were Olive Kitteridge and Jasper Jones.

Least fav would be This Is How, though as discussed it definitely got me thinking and I'm glad I read it.

I didn't read the Jan book but have done all the others.

I think considering I haven't hated or struggled with any of the books this has been a really great reading club for me, so thanks for everyone who has selected the books so far.

What about others?

Jo

I read this books a couple of months ago.

I loved it and was intrigued from the start. Utterly brilliant and clever.

My vote is for Jasper Jones. I could read that again & again

I've liked most of the books this year apart from January's and this months which were OK but not great.

I loved Olive Kitteridge, Jasper Jones, Pearl in a Cage and The Red Tent equally I think! All fabulous books. I think though possibly The Red Tent will be the one that sticks in my mind the longest. Although, Olive Kitteridge was awesome. As was Jasper Jones. Oh too hard to pick just one!

I agree Yvette, we've really read some great books haven't we. Can't wait for the next one, I'm picking up my copy today.

Jo

I have it somewhere, but it's hiding in a box among boxes. Have heard a lot about it though. Most people are strongly opinionated either way: either love or hate. A friend of mine said she hated it so much that she read a third of it before hurling it across the room I'm open minded though and will read it when it's unearthed again.

I read The Bride Stripped Bare, many years ago and didn't really think that much of it. I think all the controversy surrounding it was because it was published "anonymous". I think it is a story about a dissatisfied wife who has a series of sexual adventures.

Did anyone read another of Nikki Gemmell's books called The Book of Rapture? It was in last years list of 50 Books You Can't Put Down (or similar list!). I tried it and just couldn't stand it. But I've heard others love it?

Just saw my book is available at the library. Will pick it up tomorrow I'm into Biographies at the moment... Slightly OT but I'm reading Oprah now, quite interesting.

Kate