[Kylie Orr]

My husband is the only man I know who is hassling for a vasectomy. That’s right, he wants to have his scrotum cut and the tubes in his groin severed and seared closed. OK, a little dramatic, but that’s the process, my friends.

It is not actually the procedure he is hankering for, rather the decision. You see, I am still in limbo-land about how many children we will have. You may have read a blog I wrote a year ago about not having that “finished” feeling. I was hoping it would creep up in time, when the newborn bub became a screaming toddler. Well, he’s here - in his climbing, hitting, yelling and non-sleeping glory - but the feeling is not.

I was expecting that overwhelming finality that comes with having your last child when number three was here. I see mothers who have it: the “glad-it’s-you-not-me” women who look at other pregnant women and breathe a lung of relief. Women who could instantly vomit at the thought of having another baby.

Despite his insistence on a vasectomy, my husband and I are still in discussions about number four. Originally, it was my husband steering the boat on four, but when I was so adamant three was it, he conceded and was content with the idea. It is me who has failed the contentment test.

Before starting our family, I was whole-heartedly against the idea of four children. I am one of four, and so is the husband. Two seemed too small a family for me when I am from a larger bunch. Four seemed too many to handle. Three children was always going to be my limit. They fit in the back seat of a car for starters.

The idea of four seems ludicrous. The practicalities: cost, time, headspace, patience, commitment, healthcare, freedom. Who will volunteer to babysit four kids? How will I help four kids with their homework? Will my life be spent in a car taxiing them to sports, activities and mate’s places? How will I feed four teenage boys (let’s face it, we only breed boys in this house so there would be no doubt the 4th would be a blue one!)? Will we ever get our lives back?

It may only be one more than I have already but I’ve really noticed the additional washing and time strain with the third. How would I cope with another one? Conversely, we have well and truly passed man-on-man parenting and moved into zone defence, so would one more in the mix just slot right in?

Despite my daily self-questioning about the viability of having another child, I had never considered the thought that a fourth child was just plain greedy. This concept was introduced to me by a friend who is yet to have a family.

At first, I agreed. I have three healthy children, who was I to yearn for more? Was I pushing my luck trying for another? Would I be burdening my current children with an additional sibling to steal yet more time and resources away from them? Was it selfish to continue to expand the family I already had? What about the bigger picture – our impact on the environment in an overpopulated world?

I am still young enough to feasibly have another without causing too many complications on my body or the baby. We could manage an extra one, sure it would strain the finances but that’s not forever. Is it greedy to want another? Indicative of society’s desperate push to have more more more? Perhaps it is time to accept my gorgeous little family and close the book on the baby phase.

If only that damn maternal ache would get a day job and get off my ovaries.

I realise it is a luxury to wallow in such indecision. Many families have no choice about the number of children they will have for reasons ranging from health to infertility to finances to loss of partner. I know once the decision is made, we will cope and live with it and be very happy with our lives.

My husband is not one to linger in indecision so he suggested a deadline of Christmas Day to determine which way we would go. I just felt stressed out and teary. A trip away with the three children was going to be the clincher. I thought I’d be ringing mid-holiday to book the vasectomy for my husband. No suck luck. Holiday was great and the kids were relatively well-behaved.

So, here I am, well into January, past my deadline and no decision has been made. I still question whether it is greedy to want more. Whether we are hovering in dangerous territory; asking for trouble. Or will closing the book be a decision I regret in 20 years when I always feel like someone was missing from our family?

The greatest concern is, what if I have a fourth and don’t give birth to the done feeling? What then? A puppy? A lobotomy?

Is it greedy to want a large family? Are you from a large family? Do you have a large family and is your head still connected to your body?! Can someone make my decision for me?!

Kylie

[gendercindy]

Kylie I think you should listen to your 'ovaries' and have another baby, because I think the ovaries have a direct route to your heart, and it is clear your heart has already made its decision.

I do believe that you never regret the children you have, only the ones you don't...

My mother had three children and was never 'done' so to speak, but Dad and other 'voices' told her that three healthy children was enough...to this very day she still regrets not having her fourth...

I don't think it is worth a lifetime of regret and I certainly do not think it is greedy to want another child!

[ikt]

Is it greedy to want a large family?

Kylie

I've never seen anything suggesting having a large family is greedy, if you're in a stable relationship with stable finical conditions I see no reason why not.

[mumto4monkeys]

my heart/ ovaries would have 10+ babies,

my head only 4.

This post has been edited by acmtel: 18/01/2010, 11:03 PM

[donthavetv]

Greed indicates selfishness, I would think a childless woman is not the one to go to for advice about whether to have a fourth or not, particularly if the sum of her experience leads her to conclude carving another chunk of one self to give to another human being is being greedy.

I like your post, it is a question many women ask all the time on EB. I am however, at a loss to understand why the thrust of your argument is directed at a throwaway comment from an ill informed friend.

[Kylie Orr]

donthavetv & ikt - I see your points on the greed issue. To me, greed is associated with a finite resource, a suggestion that you are taking more than is your fair share. It doesn't apply necessarily to children you will raise, support, feed and love unless you are unable to provide these things.

donthavetv - The reason my blog was centred around the "throwaway comment" was because I had never considered that perspective before. Unfortunately my current state of clear indecision means I am swayed by whomever I spoke to last. If it is a parent with 4 children who says "don't do it!" then I lean that way. If it is a parent of 4 children who says "Go for it!" then I fall back the other way. I think it's called overthinking...

[opethmum]

I am one of five and I am the 4th child!

I would ask your partner about the insecurities and the emotions he has with having a fourth child, I am sure he has valid reasons for wanting the vasectomy.

In saying that I would not ignore your needs either. I am certainly of the opinion that large families are the best and it is certainly not greedy of you to think this way. You have a large heart and willing to love another child is enormous in itself and the fact you are willing to undergo yet another years of no sleep and aching breasts (if BF is your forte). These emotions you have you should not simply dismiss them or your partner to dismiss them.

Kids as you know are incredibly resilient and will love the fact they have someone new to get to know and love and maybe according to my eldest brother, someone to delegate his chores to! I am sure you will have and will get the physical resources to raise this potential fourth child and I am sure friends will gladly help you out.

If at the end of the day you and partner decide that the three you have are enough, I would feel complete and make the active decision to not have lingering emotions about the potential fourth child because it will get to you and also to get on with life as harsh as it may seem.

Good luck in the decision.

[DrDC]

Your husband is NOT the only man begging for a vascectomy - mine too! I am one of 5 children, he is one of 4, and given a choice, I would have had a large family.
We had the somewhat unusual situation of THINKING we had no choice about having more kids, in that our first son, born 13 years ago, was conceived with medical assistance, but the next attempts were unsuccessful. So we have taken no "precautions" for the past 15 years. We have an adopted son, now 6, and were surprised by the arrival of our 3rd son, naturally conceived, 2 years ago. Suddenly contraception is something we have to at least consider. Now I would very happily have another, but my husband, who has managed to fit in another degree during the past 10 years, just wants some sleep! We had an agreement that he could wait to have "the snip" til after I turn 40, which happens in the next couple of months. I'm definitely not ready to stop trying (especially as the chances of success are so low) but I think that it has to be a 2 person decision, or else it harms the relationship that holds the whole family together. When I realised how seriously he was trying to avoid another pregnancy (he knows my cycle better than I do!) I made the decision to stop pushing. (But there is still a small part of me that keeps on hoping....)
It is not greedy to want a large family if you have the resources to cope. It sometimes seems to me that it is only the most vulnerable and least able in our society are having large families - the rest of us are too 'greedy' to be willing to share our resources with more kids - convinced that if they can't have the best of everything, only new fashionable clothes, and a private school education, that we are somehow failing them. There are LOTs of intangible benefits that come from having a large family, that no money can buy.

[Darkmoon]

Is it greedy, no it isnt. The only 2 peoples voices you should listen to is your partners and your own in this issue. If you need any extra opinions they should come from your children, their lives will also be affected.

Who knows, maybe your partner is greedy and wants more emotional attention, and another baby would just take that away. (Purely hypothetical opinion)

Good luck with it.

[AC M2B]

I agree, that no... it is not greedy to want a large family. I am one of four and I just adore having more siblings to catch up with and worry about. I am the eldest and whilst I did at times feel like I had too much responsibility for my age and less time from my parents, we were part of a crazy and happy family and I wouldn't have changed it for the world.

Have you considered fostering children instead to make up your fourth yearning? This is an option my husband and I have been discussing. There are so many children and families that need help. Having a foster child in your family who really needs support and a loving environment around them could perhaps be the most generous thing you could give. Your family is expanded and you help others too.