[It'sallgood]

Oh- and I think now, we are starting to see a backlash because of the incredible and forced "push" to breastfeeding at all costs.
Compared to say 5-10 yrs ago, women are truly starting to get VERY angry indeed and yes, the ABA is coping a fair bit of flak as a result.

I think it would be a better way forward now, to just lay off the "push push push" OR I think the backlash against b/f will actually grow.

Women are setting up their own websites to offer bottle feeding information (I believe there is a geat Facebook page?) and I think we all know (but may not want to believe perhaps??) that plenty of women are going in, having their baby, telling the midwifes what they know they want to hear "oh yes, I'm 100% dedicated to breastfeeding and intent to continue till my child is 5 yrs old" and probably calling in at a pharmacy on the way home to stock up with bottles and formula (Ok - tad of an exaggeration, but I'm sure you know what i mean? ) !!!

I DO think that teh stats the ABA publish are somewhat misleading in that regard too...

It's no surprise to me that 90+% of women leave hospital saying they want to breastfeed (that would have been me too!) but then 3 months later it's down to 50%

Breastfeeding IS difficult for many, help of the right sort can be very hard to get, women are tired and busy and may have many competing interests in their life....and yes, formula is able to do a pretty decent job and can be much easier for many.

To me? That's okay! Each to their own really.

AS LONG AS women do get all the information adn are informed - why do some care so much how they feed their 3 month old baby?? None of anyone elses business really.

Seems to me, that too many breastfeeding advocates are the sort of people who are okay with others having "choice" as long as that choice is what THEY approve of

Tamm

[Tyrone Finkelmey...]

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This post has been edited by Tyrone Finkelmeyer: 26/03/2013, 08:46 PM

[Grey]

That's why breastfeeding is promoted - because statistically it keeps babies healthier and costs the government less money in the long and short term.

It's not being promoted - it's being pushed to the exclusion of all else, with absolutely no regard for the woman, baby's or family's circumstances or individual needs. The message isn't 'breast is best' - it is 'breast is all there is'. It's an ideal substance for feeding an infant, not the only one.

Giving women the idea that they must sacrifice their own physical and mental health in order to provide breast feeding (not even expressed EBM in a bottle is approved by some!) to their babies is wrong, no matter what spin you put on it.

It is insulting and degrading ..... to constantly suggest to women who for whatever reason, aren't entirely successful with breastfeeding or simply find it awful and don't want to do it...that there must be something WRONG with them if they don't do it

I agree. Or that they are selfish, or lazy, or aren't a very good mother. The all-or-nothing mentality really gets me. People who want to comp feed, or mix feed, or do anything to make their lives more manageable often end up fully formula feeding because they DON'T get the support in order to make even a part-time breastfeeding relationship work, but instead face condemnation and judgment for wanting (or needing) to do something other than sit and feed a baby for years on end.

This post has been edited by Grey: 23/12/2012, 03:53 PM

[It'sallgood]

Actually, I disagree with you Tigerfilly.

Who has put teh ABA in charge of public health messages? They are not an organisation that is strictly speaking, a government public health organisation.
They are their OWN body and they march to the beat of teh drum of THEIR members and goals and self-advocacy.
In fact, the government endorsed aims of breastfeeding are different from what the ABA strives for. Our government health organisations aim for 6 months of exclusive breastfeeding for example as the recommendation for Australian women, then to 12 months with food introduced.

Taht is not what the ABA aim is as I understand it? The ABA wants 24 months and all milk given to children to this age to be breastmilk.

As far as I'm aware, the government public health has no position on using EBM or bottle feeding per se, nor does the government suggest to discourage combination feeding.

But people now confuse the 2 and the impression is widely given that the ABA speaks FOR the governement health organisations and sorry, it doesn't.

What annoys me greatly is that GOVERNMENT employees, such as Midwifes are pushing heavily teh ABA aims, not the government they are working for aims, to the degree that they now do.

Formula is not illegal in this country, neither is purchasing bottles, but the way breastfeeding is pushed and Formula and bottles are actively discouraged and frowned upon etc, by government employees who are sticking to an agenda set by a non-govt organisation IS unethical and not right in my mind.

I also disagree that breastfeeding in the context of caring for the whole person and supporting them in their family life, IS as important as teh emphasis put on it.

I like to look and and care for atreat the WHOLE person and in teh context of a newborn, then in my mind, the WHOLE family environment and making a stable, loving caring and best environment for the baby to be in...then feeding is just ONE part of that.

Tamm

This post has been edited by It'sallgood: 23/12/2012, 05:02 PM

[CupOfCoffee]

I am someone who almost 15 years ago had a bad experience with the ABA (I exclusively express fed for 2 months with him, against the advice and criticism of the ABA at the time).

It is the reason why, when I had the same breastfeeding issues again with my daughter (almost 4 years ago) I told the nurse in no uncertain terms, I want to bottle feed (and didn't need someone to come talk to me). I felt like I missed the first 2 months of my sons life because of the whole experience, I wasn't doing that again.

I see motherhood holistically now, not just needing to succeed at one thing, I need to succeed overall. So my view is being kind to women, and forgiving of myself, is the best way to have positive outcomes.

[Jane Jetson]

Which bit says they help with all feeding issues?

https://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/aboutaba

Which bit says using nipple shields and EBM don't count as breastfeeding?

I think they called the ABA for breastfeeding advice, but were hoping, perhaps unconsciously, the ABA would give them permission to move to formula feeding.

What garbage. I wanted to breastfeed exclusively. So many of the posts in this thread are from women who were seeking help to *save* their breastfeeding relationship, yet this is continually ignored.

[bottle~rocket]

What evidence?

The Australian national infant feeding survey showed that the breastfeeding initiation rate was 96%, and that over 9 out of 10 women intended to breastfeed.
http://www.aihw.gov.au/media-release-detail/?id=10737420970

[katpaws]

The Australian national infant feeding survey showed that the breastfeeding initiation rate was 96%, and that over 9 out of 10 women intended to breastfeed.

That doesn't have anything to do with your statement:

But the evidence is that the majority of women do want to breastfeed, and some of thse women are being let down by a lack of adequate support and services in the postnatal period.

The only thing that link said about women not breastfeeding was:

‘Wanting to share feeding responsibilities with their partner’ and ‘previously unsuccessful breastfeeding experiences’ were the two most common reasons for not breastfeeding. Many women also felt that formula was just as good as breastmilk.

Medical reasons for mother was another reason for not breastfeeding.

WOmen not continuing with breastfeeding:

The most cited reason for not continuing breastfeeding was ‘not enough breastmilk for child’. However, this reason was cited by only of 13% mothers/carers whose child stopped receiving breastmilk after 12 months of age, compared with 56% of mothers/carers whose child stopped receiving breastmilk when aged 6 months or less (Table 4.2). Those children who stopped receiving any breastmilk when they were aged more than 12 months did so because ‘child was old enough to stop’ (63%) or ‘child lost interest’ (33%).

I don't dispute that many women want to breastfeed but i dispute your claim that women don't do it due to a lack of support and services. These reasons were not in the provided responses of mothers for discontinuing or not undertaking breastfeeding. I believe that the reasons why women don't breastfeed or discontinue with BFing can be quite complex and that stating "they don't do it due to lack of support and services" can minimise the experiences of many women. ETA: I do acknowledge that for some women having a lack of adequate services and support may influence their decision to or ability to BF, I just don't think that this is the case for all women.


So, still waiting for the evidence.

This post has been edited by katpaws: 23/12/2012, 06:59 PM

[bottle~rocket]

I meant that there is evidence that the majority of women do want to breastfeed. I didn't mean to imply there is also evidence about lack of breastfeeding support letting women down. Apologies if I was unclear.

I think the fact that 9 out of 10 women intend to breastfeed when they are pregnant, and that the breastfeeding initiation rate is 96%, are good indicators that the majority of women do want to breastfeed. I don't know of any research specifically addressing that question.


This post has been edited by bottle~rocket: 24/12/2012, 08:07 AM

[Lolpigs]

I meant that there is evidence that the majority of women do want to breastfeed. I didn't mean to imply there is also evidence about lack of breastfeeding support letting women down. Apologies if I was unclear.

I think the fact that 9 out of 10 women intend to breastfeed when they are pregnant, and that the breastfeeding initiation rate is 96%, are good indicators that the majority of women do want to breastfeed. I don't know of any research specifically addressing that question.

I think the pretense that breastfeeding is easy really got to me when I had issues. All this time I was told how wonderful it was, and how easy it was, and it was anything but.

A bit of honesty with women would probably go along way. Why would you stick at something you had been told was wonderful and easy, and then to find out it is really hard and difficult? You feel like a failure, and with the combined attitude of "you must not have tried hard enough" really cements it.