Jump to content

Hospital may not offer sterilisation, termination
New Midland (WA) Health Campus run by SJOG


  • Please log in to reply
430 replies to this topic

#1 Mummy Em

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:19 PM

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/wa/13...oing-male-snip/

QUOTE
SJGHC is the preferred operator of the planned $360 million Midland Health
Campus, which will have 367 public and private beds when it opens in 2015. It
said yesterday it could not comment on what services would be provided until
negotiations with the State Government were finalised.

But a spokeswoman for
the North Metropolitan Area Health Service said if a contract was reached with
the health group, it was expected services such pregnancy terminations,
sterilisation and contraception procedures would not be provided at the
hospital.



What do you think, should religious organisations running public hospital services be permitted to not offer certain services, as per their religious views?

Edited by Mummy Em, 14 April 2012 - 12:20 PM.


#2 Fenrir

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:26 PM

No.

If they are accepting public funding then they should offer services that the public may want. After all, an early induction under so many weeks would be classed as a pregnancy termination would it not ? Surely an emergency hysterectomy would be classed as sterilisation? Even a voluntary hysterectomy?

There is a difference between not offering because you don't have the facilities and not offering because you don't think they should happen at all.



#3 LittleListen

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:26 PM

Yes. They aren't pretending that they are going to and then refuse the service. I figure if they come right out and say it, then so be it.

An Islamic, Greek Orthodox, or Jewish school wouldn't suffer a teacher suddenly teaching from the Anglican Prayer book. I don't see how a hospital service administered by a religious group is any different to a hospital. The doctor agreed not to perform those kinds of surgeries when taking the job. If they didn't want to uphold those ideals, then work in a different hospital.

#4 Guest_tigerdog_*

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:27 PM

In a word, no.  But I guess it depends what was in the tender (if a tender process was used) - obviously if they've won the contract they have the means to provide all the services required under the contract.  I don't believe in religious organisations deviating into healthcare and other non-related service areas anyway.

When I was at one of the public hospitals in Canberra having my last baby the doctor refused to discuss contraception with me as he wasn't allowed to as the hospital is run by a Catholic organisation (in my books this constituted neglect of the hospital's duty of care to myself as the patient).

#5 EsmeLennox

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:27 PM

When they are a private enterprise, they can yes (even though I think it's ridiculous).

However, given that this is a public hospital for all intents and purposes I think it really muddies the waters. When it comes to public health I don't think religion should come into it, so I think these services should be offered at the hospital.

#6 EsmeLennox

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:30 PM

QUOTE (eyesabove @ 14/04/2012, 10:26 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yes. They aren't pretending that they are going to and then refuse the service. I figure if they come right out and say it, then so be it.

An Islamic, Greek Orthodox, or Jewish school wouldn't suffer a teacher suddenly teaching from the Anglican Prayer book. I don't see how a hospital service administered by a religious group is any different to a hospital. The doctor agreed not to perform those kinds of surgeries when taking the job. If they didn't want to uphold those ideals, then work in a different hospital.


It's different because the situation of the schools you refer to are private enterprise, as are private hospitals, the hospital in question here though is a public hospital being run by private enterprise with government money, healthcare for all, equality and all that.

Edited by Jemstar, 14 April 2012 - 12:31 PM.


#7 LynnyP

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:31 PM

I think a religious organisation should be able to do what they wish within the boundaries of their religion.

I also think that there should be minimum requirements to be eligible for geting Medicare money and one of those should be conception/termination services.

#8 Soontobegran

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:33 PM

Whilst I don't have to agree with their stance they of course have a right to decide what services they will provide. Same as religious schools are within their rights to insist on teaching scripture to it's pupils.

There are always other institutions which will perform these procedures and IME they will always refer on.


#9 LittleListen

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:36 PM

QUOTE (tigerdog @ 14/04/2012, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
In a word, no.  But I guess it depends what was in the tender (if a tender process was used) - obviously if they've won the contract they have the means to provide all the services required under the contract.  I don't believe in religious organisations deviating into healthcare and other non-related service areas anyway.


The concept of public healthcare was introduced to modern society by religious people. Today's religion-in-health-care simply mirrors what the major world religions have always taught about caring for others. The issue here is funding. If the services they are refusing to offer were specified in the tender they wouldn't have won it.  


QUOTE (Jemstar @ 14/04/2012, 12:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's different because the situation of the schools you refer to are private enterprise, as are private hospitals, the hospital in question here though is a public hospital being run by private enterprise with government money, healthcare for all, equality and all that.


True, however all of these schools also receive public funding, as to private hospitals.

#10 LynnyP

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:37 PM

Religious schools can teach scripture and get public funding but they can't refuse to teach science and get public funding.

#11 Soontobegran

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:42 PM

QUOTE (Beautiful Warlock @ 14/04/2012, 12:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
No.

If they are accepting public funding then they should offer services that the public may want. After all, an early induction under so many weeks would be classed as a pregnancy termination would it not ? Surely an emergency hysterectomy would be classed as sterilisation? Even a voluntary hysterectomy?

There is a difference between not offering because you don't have the facilities and not offering because you don't think they should happen at all.



Of course emergency surgery that involves hysterectomy will be done. Voluntary hysterectomy for medical reasons are also done!
It results in the woman being sterile but she is not being sterilised with the view of preventing further pregnancy.

Early induction if the reason is to save the mother's life is also performed in Catholic run hospitals, they will not do them to cause the death of a healthy baby in utero.

Most religious facilities like hospitals, schools, aged care etc receive public funding. I can't see us expecting them to change their philosophies because a portion of their income is from the public purse.

#12 Guest_tigerdog_*

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:44 PM

QUOTE
The concept of public healthcare was introduced to modern society by religious people. Today's religion-in-health-care simply mirrors what the major world religions have always taught about caring for others.


It seems we agree in principle but do you have any evidence of the above?  It seems like a gross generalisation - religious people don't have the monopoly on caring!  But I guess what I meant was that religious organisations shouldn't be involved in the public system (as in the OP) as they have views which might preclude certain services being offered to the public.

Nor do I believe they should be involved in profit-making private enterprise (those greedy churches!), although at least in that case they would have the freedom to offer what they like and people can choose to take it or not.  In the public system those without the means don't have any other option and as a PP stated, religion shouldn't come into it.

Edited by tigerdog, 14 April 2012 - 12:48 PM.


#13 Oriental lily

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:51 PM

In my area we are seriously lacking a public or even a private general hospital.

If an announcement came that public funded hospital was being built but would lack these essential services due to religious beliefs then I would be fuming.

If it was totally private run then that's their choice. As soon as the public dollar is being spent then religious views and choices should be binned.

You can not compare to schooling. There is a accessible public schooling to nearly all regions of Australia.

The same can not be said for health care.



#14 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:52 PM

QUOTE (tigerdog @ 14/04/2012, 10:44 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It seems we agree in principle but do you have any evidence of the above?  It seems like a gross generalisation - religious people don't have the monopoly on caring!



No, but they do have a track record of running "caring" organisations, more so than Government or private sector organisations.  There is a reason why so many religious organisations are involved in charities and community organisations - because no one else is doing it.  (Again, in general.  Obviously there are also non-religious affiliated charities too, before someone jumps on this).

I see this as the Government wanting their cake and eating it too.  They prefer someone else to run the hospital, as it is cheaper for them.  They open it to tender - and give the tender to the best choice.... The Catholic church make no secret of their policy to not perform certain procedures, but get the tender anyway.

Is it then the Church's fault?  For me, the blame lies with the Government for giving them the tender in the first place.  

And as STBG pointed out, they will undertake many of these procedures.  If a termination is life saving (physically or psychologically) it would be performed.  Same with a hysterectomy.  But they won't do tubal ligations or vasectomies.  Fair enough.

If the Government cares enough about it's people to want them to have access to contraceptive services and abortions at this hospital, they will need to run it themselves or give the tender to someone else.  Don't blame the Catholic Church for the Governments funding decision.

*Disclaimer - whilst I am a Catholic, I also support a woman's right to choose, gay marriage, and many other things the church denounces.*


#15 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:54 PM

QUOTE
Nor do I believe they should be involved in profit-making private enterprise


I think you will find that under the strictures of their "not for profit" and "Charitable organisation" status, they do not actually make a profit.  They put profits back into service provision.  Which is why Governments like them to run these services for them.

#16 Soontobegran

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:55 PM

QUOTE (Oriental lily @ 14/04/2012, 12:51 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
In my area we are seriously lacking a public or even a private general hospital.

If an announcement came that public funded hospital was being built but would lack these essential services due to religious beliefs then I would be fuming.

If it was totally private run then that's their choice. As soon as the public dollar is being spent then religious views and choices should be binned.

You can not compare to schooling. There is a accessible public schooling to nearly all regions of Australia.

The same can not be said for health care.



It is most unusual for hospitals that come under a religious umbrella to be built in areas where it is the only choice.

The public coffers fund very many things I will never utilise or agree with.....that is the way it is!



#17 Guest_tigerdog_*

Posted 14 April 2012 - 12:59 PM

QUOTE
There is a reason why so many religious organisations are involved in charities and community organisations - because no one else is doing it.


Not necessarily.  IME working in the community sector, large religious organisations have the edge over smaller, just as (if not more so!) caring organisations in winning tenders from Government as their overheads are lower and they can shift $$ between their different programs - this doesn't necssarily mean they can do a better job, sometimes Peter is robbing Paul and creative accounting allows them to deliver a bare-bones service for next to nothing while still satisfying the terms of the contract.

Edited by tigerdog, 14 April 2012 - 12:59 PM.


#18 Oriental lily

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:04 PM

It would be interesting to know if te demands for these services are easily being met in the public sector in midlands.

Ultimately this would determine how I felt if I was living in that region.

#19 JRA

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:06 PM

I think if they are running a public hospital it should offer the services required at a public hospital.

They can get away with it if running a private hospital, but public is different

#20 Jane Jetson

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:07 PM

QUOTE (tigerdog @ 14/04/2012, 12:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
When I was at one of the public hospitals in Canberra having my last baby the doctor refused to discuss contraception with me as he wasn't allowed to as the hospital is run by a Catholic organisation (in my books this constituted neglect of the hospital's duty of care to myself as the patient).


That makes two of us.

A blanket denial of particular aspects of health care, based upon religious beliefs which may not be held by these patients, is completely inappropriate. Doubly so where there is limited access to public hospitals due to distance.

#21 M1B2G

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:08 PM

Given this hospital is replacing Swan Districts which is one of the main public maternity hospitals North of the River in Perth I do hope that while they may contract out the ability to manage the hospital it should provide the same public services available now...

I know a heap of my friends who have had their children at Swan Districts but I am unsure whether it currently offers some of the services mentioned...  

I birthed at the nearest private hospital which is catholic so I understood clearly that some of the services mentioned would not be available as they were not supported by their religious faith....

Edited by LKandsoontobe3, 14 April 2012 - 01:10 PM.


#22 purplekitty

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:15 PM

It is wrong when religious doctrine interferes in the professional duty staff have to their patient.

Last year a Catholic hospital stopped oncologists from giving contraceptive advice to patients having cancer treatment with a thalidomide derivative which can cause birth defects.
My taxes should never support that.


#23 munchmum

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:21 PM

Tigerdog, gingermeg i had the same experience as did others I know. Completely inappropriate given that advice on contraception was withheld whilst advising not to get pregnant for a year for medical reasons.

#24 IShallWearMidnight

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:21 PM

i think a private hospital should offer the services it chooses to.
like stbg said they wont refuse livesaving procedures,  they just wont voluntarily end life.

#25 MrsNorris

Posted 14 April 2012 - 01:29 PM

I'm confused. Why would teh government award the contract to a health provider if the health provider cannot provide the services that the government has deemed important?  






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users

 

WIN a $500 Visa debit card

Are you a parent? Simply take our survey for your chance to win a $500 pre-paid VISA debit card.

Breastfeeding doesn't make you a better mum - feeding your baby does

Given my immense dislike of Hopkins and her opinions, I was genuinely shocked to discover that last week she actually said something that I agreed with.

'Toni, another baby has died': the anguish of watching governments fail our babies

It has been six years since whooping cough claimed the life of four-week-old Dana McCaffery. Her parents are angry that lessons learnt weren't enough to save other babies.

Longer breastfeeding linked to higher IQ

A study of 3500 infants has found that babies who are breastfed grow up to be more intelligent and wealthy.

The 2015 flu vaccine: what's new, who should get it

For certain members of the community, catching flu can lead to severe illness or death. A vaccination can be lifesaving.

Dealing with a nappy escape artist

I hear about the tots that have a penchant for ripping their nappies off and the odd one that even smears the brown stuff on the walls and fine home furnishings, and I shudder.

Hospital apologises for 'traumatising' baby mix-up

St Vincent's Hospital has apologised "unreservedly" for a baby mix-up that left one new mum traumatised.

Tips for flying with a baby

Travelling with kids requires a whole other set of skills - ones that I have learned through (sometimes unfortunate) trial and error.

How to stay calm in an emergency

I’m not expecting you to be as calm as you might be right now. What I mean is that if your panic levels are through the roof during a stressful situation, let’s bring them down to just under the ceiling.

Toddler gets 'drunk' after cranberry juice mix-up

A toddler was taken to hospital after a waitress served her sangria instead of cranberry juice at a US restaurant.

We need to stop using this word when we talk about childbirth

Is it shaming to point out that women are often being let down in birth?

The certificate helping parents deal with pregnancy loss

For some people, this certificate will offer a sense of validation that their child was acknowledged as being here and now gone, and will help them with life post-loss.

Grieving families give warnings after toddler deaths

Two Queensland families are grieving the loss of their toddler sons after the boys drowned in separate incidents last week.

The phenomenon of phantom pregnancy kicks

'Phantom pregnancy kicks’ are encountered by many mums months - or even years - after their pregnancy is over.

The health insurance advice you can't afford to ignore

There's one simple switch that could save you hundreds of dollars a year in private health insurance.

4D scans show how smoking affects babies still in the womb

The harmful effects of smoking during pregnancy on unborn babies may be seen in tiny movements in their faces using 4D ultrasound scans, research has found.

How to babyproof your job interview

Once upon a time, I was a fan of job interviews. That all changed after I'd switched careers, had a baby and decided to spend the first year at home with her.

Sign up to our 30 days of #PlayIQ challenge

Sign up to receive 30 amazing tips and ideas for play with baby during the month of April and submit a picture or tip on our social wall for a chance to win an amazing Fisher-Price prize pack.

The most dangerous toddler food trends

Pete Evans' paleo cookbook for kids caused a storm, but there are plenty of other unsafe food trends for babies and toddlers.

Infection killed new mum of twins

Modern medicine could not save 19-year-old Sophie Burgess who died 48 hours after giving birth to twins in the UK.

Win a Ben & Holly's Little Kingdom prize pack

To celebrate the April 1 release of Holly's Magic Wand on DVD and Digital, we are giving away five DVD packs featuring the newest installment of Ben & Holly's Little Kingdom Holly's Magic Wand and many more hours of family entertainment! Enter Now!

Special Ticket Offer, Save $8!

The Essential Baby & Toddler Show is back this April! Save $8 off the door price for a limited time only!

 
Advertisement
 
Advertisement
 
 
 

What's hot on EB

Sign up to our 30 days of #PlayIQ challenge

Sign up to receive 30 amazing tips and ideas for play with baby during the month of April and submit a picture or tip on our social wall for a chance to win an amazing Fisher-Price prize pack.

Man faces jail after giving woman abortion pill smoothie

A Norwegian man is facing jail after putting abortion pills in his ex-girlfriend's smoothie, causing her to have a miscarriage.

'He's a blessing': family of baby born without eyes

Jordy Jackson was born without eyes. He has anophthalmia, which affects one in every 100,000 babies born.

Win one of 5 Cadbury Easter Hampers

With Easter fast approaching, Cadbury are giving away 5 Cadbury Easter Hampers. Enter Now!

Super fit model Sarah Stage defends her pregnancy body

Model Sarah Stage has defended her pregnancy body after critics claimed her slim figure at eight-and-a-half months pregnant wasn't "normal".

Win a Ben & Holly's Little Kingdom and Peppa Pig prize pack

To celebrate the April 1 release of Holly's Magic Wand on DVD and Digital, Essential Baby and Entertainment One are giving away five bumper DVD packs featuring the newest installment of Ben & Holly's Little Kingdom Holly's Magic Wand and many more hours of family entertainment! Enter Now!

Why I post breastfeeding photos online

I love to take pictures of my children. In some of the pictures, my younger son is nursing.

The day I broke my baby

There are things I wish I didn't know. I wish I didn't know that companies make tiny braces, small enough to hold necks no bigger than a wrist.

The place just for dads of multiples

When a couple discovers they're expecting multiples, the dad can sometimes be almost forgotten in all the excitement and preparation. But one group offers a space just for dads of twins and higher-order multiples.

Brave mum calls for domestic violence law reform

A brave mum of two has shared details of the harrowing attacks she suffered at the hands of her partner in a bid to help other victims of domestic violence.

Why I had the new test for Down syndrome

Early last year I turned 35, and having just found out I was pregnant, I opted to have the new test for Down syndrome.

Geeky baby gear

If your family is more into Star Wars, gaming and the periodic table than most, you might want to check out these geek-chic baby items.

2015: the year of the sheep

According to the Chinese zodiac, babies born in the year of the sheep are creative and enjoy spending quiet time with their own thoughts.

Breakthrough genetic testing now available in Australia

Pregnant women will for the first time have access to locally analysed, accurate, non-invasive pre-natal genetic testing when the first Australian clinic to offer the services opens its doors next week.

Grandbabies: the babies born looking old

Not a day under 65 and a lifetime of struggle! That's the look of these newborns, who look adorably older than their real age. Social networking site Reddit recently featured user submissions of adorable grandbabies, here are our favourites.

Family kicked off flight after toddler seatbelt drama

An entire family was kicked off a Cathay Pacific flight when a misbehaving toddler refused to put his seatbelt on.

Stolen baby found after 17 years

A baby stolen from her mother's arms shortly after birth has been found through an astonishing coincidence.

53 creative pregnancy announcements

Announcing that you're expecting can be a time to express your creativity, sense of humour and imagination. Check out how other parents and parents-to-be have broken the news to friends and family.

IKEA hacks for the nursery and kids' rooms

Are you one of those that know the whole IKEA catalogue by heart? Love their stuff but want to personalise it? Here's some inspiration to help you realise the potential of IKEA furniture and fittings.

36 baby names inspired by food and drinks

A French court may have ruled out Nutella as a baby name, but that doesn't have to stop you from taking inspiration from the supermarket (or bottle shop). See what parents in the US have chosen for their delicious little ones.

Clever breastfeeding products

Check out this range of products designed to help make your breastfeeding journey more enjoyable, manageable and convenient.

 

Sign up now!

30 days of #PlayIQ challenge

Receive a daily email from Essential Baby during April with great play tips and ideas, then submit your baby at play photos to our Playwall, Instagram or Twitter for your chance to win.

 
Advertisement
 
 
Essential Baby and Essential Kids is the place to find parenting information and parenting support relating to conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids, maternity, family budgeting, family travel, nutrition and wellbeing, family entertainment, kids entertainment, tips for the family home, child-friendly recipes and parenting. Try our pregnancy due date calculator to determine your due date, or our ovulation calculator to predict ovulation and your fertile period. Our pregnancy week by week guide shows your baby's stages of development. Access our very active mum's discussion groups in the Essential Baby forums or the Essential Kids forums to talk to mums about conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids and parenting lifestyle. Essential Baby also offers a baby names database of more than 22,000 baby names, popular baby names, boys' names, girls' names and baby names advice in our baby names forum. Essential Kids features a range of free printable worksheets for kids from preschool years through to primary school years. For the latest baby clothes, maternity clothes, maternity accessories, toddler products, kids toys and kids clothing, breastfeeding and other parenting resources, check out Essential Baby and Essential Kids.