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#26 Future-self

Posted 12 August 2019 - 09:30 PM

That’s not normal, that is completely ****ed.
And I say that as someone whose first child was similar but the second wasn’t so I’ve lived the difference .

Get to the GP - thorough  check of  throat, ears etc and a review of reflux meds dose.

Then contact sleep school and go back.

Edited by Future-self, 12 August 2019 - 09:30 PM.

#27 PocketIcikleflakes

Posted 12 August 2019 - 09:31 PM

Have you been back to the Dr?  You mentioned reflux? Could there be ear infection or fluid? Does he snore or sleep with his mouth open? This could indicate issues with adenoids or tonsils. There's  lots of things that could be underlying the sleep issues that may have relatively quick fixes once the problem has been identified.

You have my deepest sympathy, the thought of how awful it was when my kids were babies still brings tears to my eyes. There's normal baby sleep deprivation then there's the kind of thing you're describing and they are worlds away.

#28 JoanJett

Posted 12 August 2019 - 10:09 PM

livelifelovehappy, I'm sorry for you.

I know what you're going through.  I don't remember most of my second son's baby life because I was completely sleep deprived, and in retrospect, probably had PND due to sleep deprivation.  Apart from when he was jaundiced as a newborn, he never slept more than 40-50 minutes at a time for the first year of his life.

Reflux is a killer.  The irritability and inability to settle often means that they miss the window of learning how to string sleep cycles together at the crucial age of 4-5 months.  They often need to be upright, which means support from a parent, and they often need pressure on their tummies, which also means physical contact, unless you are happy to tummy sleep.  With medications, compounded formulations tend to work better, but there is a fine balance with both weight and the durability of medications.  Either a small weight gain or a few days over the medication longevity can have significant impact.

Sleep training/consultancy is great, but balancing the needs of multiple children often means that you can't implement all the recommendations appropriately.  A firstborn "reflux baby" is much easier to manage.  Even if you do implement all the advice, it's not always a "fix".

We did all the "right" things - our bub was so bad that sedation was recommended by our well regarded sleep school to break the cycle (sedation for the baby, not me, though I would have welcomed it!).

Years down the track, our fussy baby is still an irregular sleeper.  I have no doubt that it has always been his temperament, apart from the contributing factors in the baby stage.  

So, if attending to reflux meds and further sleep training doesn't make a difference, I would suggest that you either find an outlet of a babysitter for a couple of hours per week or childcare out of home for one day per week so you can sleep or just have a break.  At the five month mark, I did just that for 4 hours once per week, even though it meant more work with pumping to cover feeds for that time.  Just having a break from the cranky sleep deprived baby made a difference, even though I was still sleep deprived.  

Sorry - no magic fix to offer, just an option to make life more bearable for you.

#29 Ivy Ivy

Posted 12 August 2019 - 10:17 PM

Review your diet.
With my 1st child I could eat an entire big 250g choc easter egg bunny a day and she still slept beautifully (she was born near Easter).  
2nd child, if I ate a tiny amount of chocolate, his little brain would be alert, no sleep.  I gave up chocolate for 3y to breastfeeding.  He still can't eat choc after dinner and sleep, years later.

Hire a night nurse to hold him?

#30 Apageintime

Posted 13 August 2019 - 12:43 PM

Get a check on the cause of the reflux, there often is an allergy or intolerance (dairy is common) or possibly a tongue tie.

My wakeful baby was tongue tied. Once that was fixed the reflux stopped and he was much happier.

All the sleep schools in the world wouldn't have helped until he wasn't in pain any more

#31 Apageintime

Posted 13 August 2019 - 12:44 PM

Get a check on the cause of the reflux, there often is an allergy or intolerance (dairy is common) or possibly a tongue tie.

My wakeful baby was tongue tied. Once that was fixed the reflux stopped and he was much happier.

All the sleep schools in the world wouldn't have helped until he wasn't in pain any more

#32 froglett

Posted 13 August 2019 - 02:10 PM

You poor thing OP. I remember the sheer hell of it - my firstborn (very nearly only born) was the same.

Sounds as though there may be a couple of things going on. She sounds terribly overtired, so that will probably be making the wake ups more frequent.

But, I'd be going straight to the Dr for a review of the reflux meds and to rule out ear infections (my son was prone to them and had similar wake up patterns).

I'd probably also beg the doctor to give another referral to sleep school (if you need another referral) and then book in.

Like PP have said, maybe you could enlist a family member / friend to drive her around, so she / you can have some solid sleep time?

I'm so sorry :(

#33 Bearynice

Posted 13 August 2019 - 04:39 PM

OP I just wanted to check in on you and see that you are ok?

I hope today has been ok for you

#34 No Drama Please

Posted 13 August 2019 - 11:56 PM

Omg you poor thing, I’ve been there. I literally remember freaking out that I might die from being so tired as well. Not sure if this is option but for a while I would go to bed at 7pm and DP would look after them till he went to bed, so at least I’d get 4 hours. I co-slept as well, I just couldn’t survive otherwise. Do anything that works, try all the things x

#35 Ellie bean

Posted 14 August 2019 - 12:04 AM

Oh god it’s hell isnt it OP. I had 2 reflux cmpi babies in the space of 12 months and it nearly bloody killed me. Was so tired I actually don’t remember conceiving number 2, he could be a miracle for all I know! Agree about your husband doing a shift, mine did 8-1 or so then we’d swap. For us, we needed highest dose of reflux meds for their age and weight, no cows milk protein (mine were on prescription formula but I know lots of people bf and do elimination diet), zipped into swaddles as they seemed to get less overstimulated that way, day naps held in arms or strapped to me just so they would sleep and not get too overtired.  Mine couldn’t lie flat, both slept in a bouncer inside a cot as that was the only way we could put them down at all but I really really wouldn’t recommend that without medical advice due to the sids risk, we only did it because the alternative (me holding them in an armchair) was less safe. You will survive, it will get better x

#36 PrincessPeach

Posted 14 August 2019 - 02:17 PM

^ different reason, but i know i had DS2 sleeping in the pram for a few nights there. He was a bit older at the time, but had bronchiolitis - he had to sleep propped upright to be able to breathe.

OP - do whatever you can, but certainly book your baby in to see a decent GP to rule out medical reasons & also see how soon you can get back to sleep school.

I also echo a PP suggestion of looking for food intollerances: caffeine, onions, chilli, caffeine & garlic are a few more that can be causing things.

#37 quartz85

Posted 14 August 2019 - 03:47 PM

That sounds medical. If be getting a GP review and an urgent appointment with a paed. DS was a reflux baby. Turned out to be food allergies. No amount of sleep training, co-sleeping, attachment parenting works when they are in pain.

The advice that it's normal, ride it out, co-sleep really isn't helpful when you have a baby that unsettled. My reflux baby never had developmental sleep regressions. His sleep regressed when he outgrew his reflux meds.

RISA is a great source of information and support for dealing with reflux babies. Do not underestimate how hard reflux is. It's so far from the realm of normal it's not funny.

#38 PooksLikeChristmas

Posted 14 August 2019 - 04:41 PM

In the meantime, please recognise that you’re in crisis and get as much help as you can afford, ask for, access. Are your older kids in childcare or school with after school care? You may be eligible for fee support so you can use it more while navigating this. We can’t do this on our own.

#39 PocketIcikleflakes

Posted 14 August 2019 - 09:45 PM

As pooks said.

#40 Silverstreak

Posted 15 August 2019 - 08:07 AM

Just checking in xo

#41 livelifelovehappy

Posted 21 August 2019 - 06:46 PM

 Flaxen, on 12 August 2019 - 08:49 PM, said:

Eta: I can recommend something... take away any possible source of you being able to tell the time. It really did help my sanity and stress levels by not actually realising that it was already 3 wakings and not yet 3am (or similar)
And we ended up cosleeping.

This has actually been very helpful for me. I have also stopped counting the wake ups, it's pointless and depressing.

Her reflux is out of control, we're finally under the guidence of a GI ped, and things are improving a bit, still terrible but less terrible - have been getting some 2-3 hour blocks among the every hour. I feel like she's got allergies and I've eliminated so much from my diet, I am seriously considering switching to formula and seeing how that goes. She wakes choking on vomit, I feel so bad for her.

My husband is taking a shift from 5-8:30am so I can sleep. As exhausted as I am, I cannot go to sleep at 7pm, it's just not possible. I have a babysitter for a few hours a week for the other kids, but I cannot leave the baby with anyone else like this.

I hope things improve with time and the new medication she has started on.

Thank you everyone.

Edited by livelifelovehappy, 21 August 2019 - 06:51 PM.

#42 Ellie bean

Posted 21 August 2019 - 07:52 PM

If you’re going to switch to formula, get the paeds advice- my babies needed elemental prescription formula, normal cows milk wouldn’t have helped, I know other babies have needed different things, I would do it all under medical guidance
I pumped and dumped for a while too so i has the option to go back to bf if needed (I didn’t need to but at least the option was there)
Good luck and hope things improve

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