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Taxbill to pass the senate - but who gets the $1080 rebate?


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#101 born.a.girl

Posted 06 July 2019 - 12:40 PM

View PostLesley225, on 06 July 2019 - 12:02 PM, said:

In the tax sense there is no gross income minus tax withheld.

Everything is  either worked out on taxable income or Adjusted taxable income.  Or in some cases like Medicare family income.

You're right that to the tax department there is no relevance of net pay, but in a tax sense there is absolutely gross income minus tax withheld, so much so that it's a legal requirement for employers to put that net figure on a payslip.

The fact that net is irrelevant for this particular calculation, as I clarified to person who used 'net', doesn't make the word 'net' irrelevant.

http://What Info Doe...super was paid.



This side issue started with responses to your comment that:

Quote

Taxable income is basically net income.


#102 -Emissary-

Posted 07 July 2019 - 12:17 PM

View PostSweet.Pea, on 06 July 2019 - 07:12 AM, said:



Well why would anyone complain?

The election was in May and the people voted for this party so they would get their tax cut.

When K-Rudd announced his stimulus package, he was blasted at for wasting money and how Australia would be in debt for years and how labour was mismanaging the economy.

No one will be blasting the Liberals for mis managing the economy this time around because it’s going in their pocket. No one will wonder how the Liberals will fund this and what public services will be cut.

I’m just calling out what a bunch of selfish hypocrites Liberal voters are.

Edited by -Emissary-, 07 July 2019 - 12:25 PM.


#103 Lesley225

Posted 07 July 2019 - 12:54 PM

I'm just listening to Insiders and reading the newspapers this morning and I can't get over how many are talking about income tax cuts.

The only tax cuts are years away and may never arrive.  What they are legislating is an offset.  So you're only going to get it once a year and only is you earn more than average but less than a lot will you get the highest amount.

I don't think anyone knows what they are talking about and many are going to be dissapointed.

#104 Splodge83

Posted 08 July 2019 - 08:04 PM

Well I totally screwed myself this year :( I work for a NFP and salary sacrificed 15k, was told it wouldn't affect my FTB as its an exempt FBT.  Get my group certificate and they've added back so my 50k salary has actually turned into $60k salary for FTB and I will only get the smaller bonus as my taxable income is 35k. I wish I had sought a second opinion as I have a feeling we will now owe back a fortune in FTB and CCS.

Whilst I appreciate the ability to salary sacrifice I think I would have been better off not salary sacrifice

#105 Splodge83

Posted 08 July 2019 - 08:18 PM

View PostFresh Start, on 08 July 2019 - 08:11 PM, said:

NFPs are an exempt fringe benefit. What that means is that they will affect your FTB but not by as much as non-exempt fringe benefits.

If you didn’t include it anywhere in your estimate you will have a debt for FTB but for CCS you get 85% until your family income is over the mid $60k range so you might be okay there.

Going forward include the grossed up value at the EXEMPT FRINGE BENEFITS component and DHS will automatically apply the formula that reduces the amount assessed.

Thanks Fresh Start,  I only estimated 50k as my annual income. I'll make sure I do it right this year!

#106 Hollycoddle

Posted 09 July 2019 - 01:39 PM

View PostSweet.Pea, on 06 July 2019 - 07:26 AM, said:



They have it to some welfare recipients too. People on Youth Allowance got a payment.

As well as people on Parenting Payments.

#107 Beancat

Posted 09 July 2019 - 01:47 PM

Just submitted my tax return - I get none of the offset :(


Oh well cannot complain, I'm just annoyed at how the media has portrayed it.  I always knew I wouldn't qualify but there will be those people. as PPs have said, that have probably already spent it and will not be entitled to either the full amount of any at all

#108 Purple Polka Dots

Posted 09 July 2019 - 01:52 PM

I get very confused with tax stuff - FTB, offsets, a tax cut...

I think I will have earned about 63k for the last financial year, but not sure where that puts me.

#109 BadCat

Posted 09 July 2019 - 01:55 PM

No idea if I'll get it or not.  Probably will.  Would rather it go to something useful though.

#110 Gonzy

Posted 09 July 2019 - 02:12 PM

I am so confused with all the net/gross/taxable stuff also :huh:

#111 born.a.girl

Posted 09 July 2019 - 07:10 PM

View PostFresh Start, on 09 July 2019 - 06:34 PM, said:

You’ll get something but not a $1080 rebate.


Tax offset from $48k to $90k is $1080, isn't it?

#112 Tinkle Splashes

Posted 09 July 2019 - 11:05 PM

View PostLesley225, on 07 July 2019 - 12:54 PM, said:

I'm just listening to Insiders and reading the newspapers this morning and I can't get over how many are talking about income tax cuts.

The only tax cuts are years away and may never arrive.  What they are legislating is an offset.  So you're only going to get it once a year and only is you earn more than average but less than a lot will you get the highest amount.

I don't think anyone knows what they are talking about and many are going to be dissapointed.

The future tax cuts have been legislated though.  Sure, the legislation may be repealed before then, but that won't be easy and if it isn't repealed, the tax cuts will happen with no further legislation being required.

#113 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 06:36 AM

View PostTinkle Splashes, on 09 July 2019 - 11:05 PM, said:

The future tax cuts have been legislated though.  Sure, the legislation may be repealed before then, but that won't be easy and if it isn't repealed, the tax cuts will happen with no further legislation being required.


Couldn't Labor go to the next election promising to repeal the legislation regarding the high income tax cuts?

Lord knows were a low enough taxing country as it is for that group.

They'd have been paying 60c in the dollar on anything over less than double average wages in the 80s.

#114 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:05 AM

View PostFresh Start, on 09 July 2019 - 09:35 PM, said:

Oh yes I think that was the top end, I didn’t go back to the table just operated from memory!

Should never do that AND I called it a rebate not an offset. Clearly a bad day for me.


We all have those days.  TBH I did have to go and double check wondering if I'd got something mixed up - my recall is not as reliable as I'd like it to be!

Your explanation on FBT and the need for tax returns in another thread had my head spinning!

#115 Renovators delight

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:41 AM

Does anyone know if the e-tax thing on the ATO website where you can calculate your tax factoring in the offset now? I finally got to submit our tax yesterday after DP got his hands on a payment summary, and it seemed that the calculation was a little higher than when I looked last week.

#116 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:46 AM

View PostRenovators delight, on 10 July 2019 - 07:41 AM, said:

Does anyone know if the e-tax thing on the ATO website where you can calculate your tax factoring in the offset now? I finally got to submit our tax yesterday after DP got his hands on a payment summary, and it seemed that the calculation was a little higher than when I looked last week.


The refund was higher??


Can't help you with an answer, but last year, without any legislative changes, my husband's came up with a refund figure, yet I (a retired accountant) did a back of the envelope calculation which said a payment needed.  Was told on their 'chat' function that 'not to worry, when you submit it, it will be right'.  Hmmm, helpful.  Decided to try a week later (no change of information, checked line by line, and the refund had diminished quite a bit. At least closer.   Submitted, got the refund, and a few months later, got an adjusted statement requiring payment which showed the calculations exactly as I'd done them.

I pity the poor staff having to deal with the technology.

#117 Renovators delight

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:52 AM

View Postborn.a.girl, on 10 July 2019 - 07:46 AM, said:

The refund was higher??


Can't help you with an answer, but last year, without any legislative changes, my husband's came up with a refund figure, yet I (a retired accountant) did a back of the envelope calculation which said a payment needed.  Was told on their 'chat' function that 'not to worry, when you submit it, it will be right'.  Hmmm, helpful.  Decided to try a week later (no change of information, checked line by line, and the refund had diminished quite a bit. At least closer.   Submitted, got the refund, and a few months later, got an adjusted statement requiring payment which showed the calculations exactly as I'd done them.

I pity the poor staff having to deal with the technology.

Oh dear.

Yes, the refund, sorry! DP had 6 weeks unpaid leave from work this year (went overseas volunteering) and we don't claim the full health insurance rebate from our insurer, so was expecting about $2K back, but the calculation was closer to $3k. Mine was a mess because of my change from work income to income stream, but also went up by about $500.

#118 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:55 AM

View PostRenovators delight, on 10 July 2019 - 07:52 AM, said:

Oh dear.

Yes, the refund, sorry! DP had 6 weeks unpaid leave from work this year (went overseas volunteering) and we don't claim the full health insurance rebate from our insurer, so was expecting about $2K back, but the calculation was closer to $3k. Mine was a mess because of my change from work income to income stream, but also went up by about $500.


Sounds to me like they've now included it, but as I said, I don't trust the calculator anyway.  I don't even necessarily trust the end result after last year.

#119 mumbag

Posted 10 July 2019 - 03:12 PM

View PostLucrezia Borgia, on 05 July 2019 - 11:59 AM, said:

that’s true - the reserve bank has called on the govt to do something. they can’t really go any lower on interest rates, AND if this does indeed increase spending - thus giving them more GST revenue then it *could* be a good thing...if that increased GST revenue then gets turned into increased funding for health, education, NDIS etc etc.

i have no real skin in this game - i won’t really benefit from it personally - my party - labor - supported it - possibly for the above mentioned reasons.

i’m trying to be non partisan on this - i’ve read plenty of negative opinions on it - which i nodded along with but they were playing into all my confirmation biases.

here is a positive spin -

https://www.smh.com....705-p524eu.html

i haven’t quite gone the Australian - this is fairfax - written by Switzer....Centre for Independent Studies, so - make of that what you will.

i dunno - it’s making me uneasy -

“That mindset has changed. After days of dealing, something genuinely good has emerged from Parliament: a flatter personal income tax structure that increases incentives to work harder, save more and invest in the future. The hope now is that the three-stage tax plan could reignite a broader reform agenda.“

“There is, moreover, a broader philosophical point to keep in mind. Taxes should be cut not for their own sake, but to encourage enterprise, individual responsibility and self-reliance – and boost revenue. Lower taxes boost revenues by encouraging economic activity.“

“When people see that they will pay less tax on the next dollar they earn, they’re likely to work harder to earn more dollars. Such an incentive-driven rate cut makes our society more aspirational and stimulates growth overall.“

that’s the positive spin guys. i can’t help but think they’ve hoodwinked us.

My bold = code for cutting services.

Also, incentives to work hard aren't needed in this tax bracket, they're needed at the end where losing welfare benefits outweighs the additional income from working. Which could be fixed by a non-means-tested universal income safety net instead of highly policed welfare for the deserving poor only. But nah, why give money to people who will spend it and stimulate the economy when you can reward the social class you come from instead.

#120 alias grace

Posted 10 July 2019 - 04:53 PM

View Postborn.a.girl, on 10 July 2019 - 06:36 AM, said:

Couldn't Labor go to the next election promising to repeal the legislation regarding the high income tax cuts?

Lord knows were a low enough taxing country as it is for that group.

They'd have been paying 60c in the dollar on anything over less than double average wages in the 80s.

Whilst I do not personally agree with the Government's proposed "stage 3 tax cuts", I disagree with the notion that Australia is already a low taxing country for high income earners when you consider our personal tax rates on an international stage (I don't think that the personal tax rates that we paid almost 40 years ago are a particularly relevant comparator).  In particular, Australia has the 14th highest top marginal tax rate out of the 36 OECD countries and also the 15th lowest income threshold at which the top marginal tax rate applies.  So, by my reckoning, Australia is currently the 5th highest taxing country of high earning individuals in the OECD, behind only Sweden, Denmark, the Netherlands and Ireland, if both the rate and the threshold are taken into account.

https://stats.oecd.o...etCode=TABLE_I7

Edited by alias grace, 10 July 2019 - 04:59 PM.


#121 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 05:02 PM

^^^ We are a low taxing country.  The comparisons are extremely complex and don't just involve marginal tax rates.


https://insidestory....oo-progressive/

#122 alias grace

Posted 10 July 2019 - 05:46 PM

^^^ Many thanks for the article, I will read through it again in more detail when I have some more time.  I agree that making comparisons between countries is very complex, much more so than I made out in the post above.  However, I do believe that Australia already has a highly progressive income tax system (which the article confirms) which is definitely a good thing and something that I would much prefer to see retained.

#123 born.a.girl

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:06 PM

View Postalias grace, on 10 July 2019 - 05:46 PM, said:

^^^ Many thanks for the article, I will read through it again in more detail when I have some more time.  I agree that making comparisons between countries is very complex, much more so than I made out in the post above.  However, I do believe that Australia already has a highly progressive income tax system (which the article confirms) which is definitely a good thing and something that I would much prefer to see retained.


You're right, too, that times can't be compared. They need to be considered in an international sense.

It's almost impossible to compare countries though, even the best economists agree, given the way the systems work. The state taxes we recently paid in Canada varied from 5 - 17% so hard to categorise as a country. (Wonderful place.)

You'll note, too, we are very low on the social security spending scale.

I wholeheartedly agree too, on a progress income tax scale, and why I will always disagree with expenses like childcare being a tax deduction. Some things are appropriate via the tax system, some are appropriate via the welfare system.


ETA: And I'm sorry, I tried to find the not-so-long-ago article by Peter Martin, about us being a low taxing country, but obviously not using the right search terms.

Edited by born.a.girl, 10 July 2019 - 07:08 PM.


#124 Lunafreya

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:08 PM

I won’t get it. And I really resent being told to “work harder” by the government.

#125 JRA

Posted 10 July 2019 - 07:35 PM

I must admit I don't get why people are up in arms about it being a tax offset rather than a tax cut (other than the amount they get). Either way for those that receive it, they pay less tax, whether it is a tax offset or a tax cut.



View PostLunafreya, on 10 July 2019 - 07:08 PM, said:

I won’t get it. And I really resent being told to “work harder” by the government.

I thought everyone got something unless they earned over $126K or such. Is that not the case. Or are you complaining as you are over $126K you don't get it.




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