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Spinoff - Will DD be an ungrateful monster?


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#1 Tesseract

Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:49 PM

Spinoff from the apology thread.

I was pleasantly surprised to see that I'm not the only crazy mother out there who doesn't do forced apologies.

But what about forcing pleases and thank yous? And by force I mean the child doesn't get the biscuit until she says 'please', then perhaps she is restricted from walking away/eating biscuit until she says 'thank you'.

DH and I are in disagreement about this. I model pleases and thank yous, I also say please and thank you on DD's behalf (she's 23 months), even to myself "thank you Mummy". I tell DD often that people appreciate it when you say please and thank you, so it's a nice thing to do when they are giving you something. But if she doesn't say it I don't push it. DH on the other hand is always trying to actually force her to say please (he's not so obsessed with thank yous, by then he's already distracted by something else lol!).

Anyway I know there are a lot of people who force please and thank you. But for those of you who don't - how is it working out for you? Do your kids say it? Or will DD really turn out like an ungrateful monster just like people fear?

#2 shanta

Posted 25 January 2013 - 01:59 PM

I did the same as you and my 6 year old has beautiful manners. I also used to say it for him if he didn't. I got annoyed with people who would force it out of him because I could see he was grateful. I think manners are extremely important and being grateful will open your energy to receive even more. It gives you an easier life.

Edited by shanta, 25 January 2013 - 02:02 PM.


#3 Propaganda

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:01 PM

I force it.

Whether it's meant or not, it's still polite to say it. I did it hoping that it would just become habit and it has.

#4 Guest_Dinah_Harris_*

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:03 PM

I force it, and my 4 year old does it all the time, almost without thinking about it.  She has lovely manners.
Nothing worse than a person who doesn't say please, thank you or pardon me.

#5 Cat People

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:03 PM

I have to be completely honest and say it's working out badly for us so far!   He's nearly 6 and I think his manners are a bit appalling.  But he's also a bit of an enigma of a kid so I honestly believe forcing wouldn't have made much difference.  On the other side, I have an amazingly polite 2 year old who not only uses please and thank you, but also "excuse me" and "sorry", and all of that is just from modelling rather than insisting.

#6 EssentialBludger

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:05 PM

Yes, I force please and thank yous. My kids don't get anything without manners, and it's just second nature now.


I was standing in line at a lunch bar the other day, there was a kid in front of me about 9-10 who when being served said "give me a xxx". No please. It made my skin crawl.

I'd overheard her parents talking earlier about how she goes to one of the most prestigious schools in Perth. I guess money doesn't buy manners. ph34r.gif


Yes, I'm a judgemental cow.

#7 TotesFeral

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:05 PM

I'm kind of in the middle. Sometimes I do force, sometimes I just do what you do which is say "Thank you mummy" and she repeats it.
It has gotten to the point now where 90% of the time she says please and thank you with no prompting. But if she does ask for something herself and doesn't say please I'll say "Well what do you say?" and she says "Please mummy!"

#8 Jenferal

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:06 PM

I model it personally.
I DID do the whole "ta" thing for a while, but it got boring, so we just do regular please and thank you normally and my nearly 3yr old has picked it up herself.

I remember commenting to my husband about how she'd picked up saying plse and thank you and he pointed out it's how we talk to each other, and she copied us.
not everytime, but most times anyway so far.

#9 Shirley Sue

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:08 PM

I have to agree with you op. I prefer to model 'please' and 'thank you" rather than force it. Imo pushing kids to say it creates a battle of wills. My dd is 16 mo and already says thank you in the correct context. Sounds more like "ka ku" but I know what she means lol. I prefer that she says it and means it rather than saying it just to say it.

#10 ~faerydust~

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:09 PM

I encourage and model but don't force. I have had many comments on how beautiful my 4yo's manners are. My 22 month old has learnt both from us as well as her sister and consistently uses please, thankyou, and wulk (you're welcome).

#11 Feral Nicety

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:10 PM

I modelled and insisted on please and thank you.

My DSD'smother did not model and did not require her daughter to say please and thank you as she felt it was something that would naturally develop.  It didn't wink.gif.

I don't know that saying please and thank you means the kid feels more gratitude but I do think it greases the wheels of social discourse.

#12 Julie3Girls

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:12 PM

At 23 months, the age of your child, I modelled it. My older two girls actually weren't talking that much at that age, so yes I would pretty much just model it myself, and praise when they did it on their own.

As they got older, I started to prompt - if they asked for something and didn't say please or thankyou I'd say "And what do you say?" and would get a response pretty quick.

A bit older again, and the manners were pretty good, but if I've noticed them dropping off, I would push for it a bit. And yes, I have done the whole not pouring a drink until I was asked nicely with manners! But that was when they were at an age when I knew they could use their manners and were simply being slack about it. Not when they were just learning to talk and how to say please and thankyou.

#13 Eirinn

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:16 PM

I model it, and I also ask them to say it. If they don't, I don't force them to, but I do explain why manners are important.

They have fairly good manners at age 3 and 2.

#14 NunSoFeral

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:17 PM


Depends on age - ovr 4's - I ignore until they ask nicely, without whinging and with manners.
Between 2-4 - I model, raise an eyebrow, and get more insistent when they are approaching 4.

Worked pretty well.
The 2 yr old is saying "pwease" and "sankyu mamma, thats lubley" regularly now.
Not usually moved by cute but this slays me.

Table manners are proving to be my bugbear.
Anyone have any hints for controlling the inner-savage?

Open mouth chewing and talking, lounging, elbows up at 90 degree angles, snags ricocheting across the table, fingers down on fork tines and on knife blade - so coated with food and the inevitable tomato sauce.

Meal times are worthy of donning a flak jacket and HazMat suit here.

****ing revolting.

#15 Canberra Chick

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:48 PM

I model and force. It worked for me. Rude kids get nothing was what I was brought up with, as was DH.

#16 emlis22

Posted 25 January 2013 - 02:55 PM

I'm the kind of person who forces it on adults (I'm close with, not strangers), or I say it under my breath for somebody else. I feel extremely uneasy if people don't say please.

#17 123tree

Posted 25 January 2013 - 03:19 PM

I agree with both modelling and insisting.  It never seizes to amaze me though to see grown ups force "please" and "thank you" but not actually use it themselves in their own dialogue.

Here is my chance to stand on my soap box and say I HATE it when old people say "What is the magic word".  It isn't a magic word.  It is a special word, a feel good word but nothing is magic about it.

#18 mpoppins92

Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:14 PM

QUOTE (gettheetoanunnery @ 25/01/2013, 12:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Depends on age - ovr 4's - I ignore until they ask nicely, without whinging and with manners.
Between 2-4 - I model, raise an eyebrow, and get more insistent when they are approaching 4.

Worked pretty well.
The 2 yr old is saying "pwease" and "sankyu mamma, thats lubley" regularly now.
Not usually moved by cute but this slays me.

Table manners are proving to be my bugbear.
Anyone have any hints for controlling the inner-savage?

Open mouth chewing and talking, lounging, elbows up at 90 degree angles, snags ricocheting across the table, fingers down on fork tines and on knife blade - so coated with food and the inevitable tomato sauce.

Meal times are worthy of donning a flak jacket and HazMat suit here.

****ing revolting.


I did this for the kids I look after, I made little stick people with their faces on them and I wrote a little story about these people. I called them yummy tummy people and I wrote about what they did. (not talking with food in their mouths, trying all the food etc) you could write what the specific issues are for your kids. At the end of the story these special yummy tummy people travel from yummy tummy land because their special friends *gettheetoanunnery child a and b* aren't following the yummy tummy rules and they had to go and help them out. Like a secret mission if you will. Then I stuck the yummy tummy people in front of their placemats to remind them of the behaviour. We read the story a few times a week at first, then less and less and eventually I only needed to say "Is this yummy tummy behaviour?" and the kids would know what I meant. I incorporated sticker rewards into it aswell and eventually the yummy tummy people went back to yummy tummy land. They make occasional appearances again when needed though. Hope it helps  original.gif

#19 Propaganda

Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:25 PM

I don't accept a lack of please or thank you from other children either. I will just stare at them silently if they don't use their manners and wait. If they don't catch on, I'll try and help them to see what I'm waiting for, but I'm not going to give in to a lack of manners.

I don't think I've encountered many adults that don't know how to be polite, but when my husband decides to not use his, I use them for him, condescendingly (when he doesn't thank me for handing him his dinner, which I just cooked for him, for example) in hopes he understands how unimpressed I am with the lack of his manners.

#20 Feral Grey Mare

Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:33 PM

QUOTE (Jenflea @ 25/01/2013, 03:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I model it personally.
I DID do the whole "ta" thing for a while, but it got boring, so we just do regular please and thank you normally and my nearly 3yr old has picked it up herself.

I remember commenting to my husband about how she'd picked up saying plse and thank you and he pointed out it's how we talk to each other, and she copied us.
not everytime, but most times anyway so far.


Children learn the most by imitating those around them so you can pat yourselves on the back here. Sure, its not going to work every time but by talking politely to each other you are setting a great example.

It used to really annoy me when I was helping in the school canteen and no pleases or thank yous were forthcoming. I used to ask if they would like some manners with their order.

#21 sāta kōrsa

Posted 25 January 2013 - 04:47 PM

We both model and force too, although 'force' sounds a bit brutal, lol.  DS's default at the moment is to bark orders at me.  I just look at him and generally only need to raise an eyebrow to get a smile and a 'please mummy'.  He knows that demanding what he want gets him nothing, but he still tries it on.

#22 zogee

Posted 25 January 2013 - 06:27 PM

I model and insist on please and thankyou. I can't stand rudeness in  adults -or kids who are old enough to know better. I think kids who aren't taught to say this automatically will find social situations awkward as its an accepted convention in our society. That and they'll probably get reprimanded for lack of manners by strangers, and I'd rather be the one teaching my kids what's appropriate.    

Edited for typo

Edited by zogee, 25 January 2013 - 06:28 PM.


#23 ~Supernova~

Posted 25 January 2013 - 06:31 PM

Model and force here. If you can't ask nicely, you don't deserve to have whatever it is IMO. I was raised very strictly with manners, and it is something that is very important to me. Nothing quite like telling another child they need to say please first, being answered with either a blank stare or rudeness...it's not hard to teach manners people!

#24 fruitbat72

Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:18 PM

Ì always have been very strict on manners, even though I am a completely half a*sed mother the rest of the time. I prefer gentle reminders to "forcing" the issue. To DH and I, being polite is something that should come automatically- it shows respect for the other person

The result is DD1 (6) has beautiful manners and her teachers have commented on what a lovely, polite child she is. DD2 (19 months) says Thank You and Excuse Me now - she doesn't say much apart from that but we think it's a good start.

#25 4kidlets

Posted 25 January 2013 - 07:21 PM

I agree with modelling and prompting - forcing sounds a harsh word but have not given the wanted thing until please has been said, so  I guess I am a forcer too.


QUOTE
Here is my chance to stand on my soap box and say I HATE it when old people say "What is the magic word".  It isn't a magic word.  It is a special word, a feel good word but nothing is magic about it.


Ive probably been known to use this phrase myself ph34r.gif

I guess  I could change it to 'whats the special word' but really seems semantics - I dont think anyone, even children, take the phrase literally.




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