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also about breast feeding sorry!


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#1 Excentrique Feral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:16 AM

All this breastfeeding argument has got me thinking about tribes and native societies. Often in these more remote communities women only wear a skirt or similar. The breasts are not covered. Women are seen feeding all the time without any part of the area covered and no-one seems offended.

Maybe the issue is that breasts in western society are overly sexualised, and that is why everyone gets so offended by public breastfeeding. Or do the men in these cultures get annoyed when they see the women feeding their babies outside the hut?? lol.

WDYT?

#2 Country (deci)Mel

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:24 AM

In cultures where breasts are exposed in traditional clothing you will generally find that it is the female backside that is the erotic, highly sexually charged area.

So wandering around in your short shorts and a smock  is obscene.. bare breasts and a skirt you are ok.  


(although if your breasts are a different colour to the regular breasts on show you will still find yourself the centre of a lot of attention!  *please note voice of bitter experience in posting*)

#3 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:40 AM

Countrymel, That requires more explanation.

Yes, I think there is this false idea that breasts are sexual, so some people can't separate out the functional aspect. They see babies feeding as sexual, primitive, uncouth.

#4 I'm Batman

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:42 AM

oh Mel, did you put on a show?


hahahhahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhahahhahahahhahahahhahahhahahhahahahahhahah



#5 Country (deci)Mel

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:48 AM

Hey everyone else had theirs out I am nothing if not a follower!

Unfortunately my glaringly white breasts with their tiny pink nipples were even more interesting apparently than my curly blonde hair! (which had been getting quite a workout - it's hilarious apparently!)

My boyfriend of the time returned to the village and was highly amused to seem me surrounded by a gaggle of women who were all taking turns to cup my breasts in their hands and speak earnestly among themselves..  

I swear there was only 5 people there when I arrived, by the time he turned up there were about 30!


Ah... happy days, happy days!

#6 RedBob

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:49 AM

It's not a false idea that breasts are sexual, that is what their primary purpose in western society is. I'm not sure how it happened, but the dominant narrative in western society is that breasts are there for the titillation of men. That's why we have page 3 girls, that's why we have push up bras, cosmetic boob jobs, low cut tops, men yelling out "show us your tits" or "get your boys out for the boys".

It's also why so many men, and women, find it so deeply disturbing when they see breasts being used for their biological purpose, ie feeding the young of our species. And when you combine into that the fact that for the last few generations, bottlefeeding was promoted as being much better than breastfeeding (thus allowing no dilution of the "breasts are for men" idea), you can sort of understand, although NOT agree with, where their minds are at.

#7 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:53 AM

My bad, bob, I should have said "only" sexual.

Mel, that is hilarious. I wonder what they were saying.  laugh.gif

#8 sarkazm76

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:57 AM

I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.



#9 RedBob

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:00 AM

No probs, Riotproof, I did think it was a leetle unusual of you to have phrased it that way.

Lol, Mel, they were probably exclaiming about the whiteness, and the little nipples and wondering if they'd do the job wink.gif

#10 Mrs Dinosaurus

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:11 AM

Mel that is an awesome story.

I agree with Bob. My DH was/is a full on boobs man, not in a gross way (in fact it was many months into our relationship before i figured this out as he would never have said anything himself) but still, he likes boobs.

Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.

And he's a keeper. SO I figure all the voices screaming "be discreet, cover up, stay at home" have similar or stronger feelings than him but are happy to vocalise it more.

Neither of my GMs breastfed, the government provided them with formula and bottles. My Mum didn't breastfeed. I am the first person in my family in 3 generations to breastfeed. That's a whole lot of influence to undo and i imagine it will take more than 3 generations since it isn't government sponsored.

Sigh.



#11 Lolpigs

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:15 AM

QUOTE (Dinosaurus @ 22/01/2013, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Mel that is an awesome story.

I agree with Bob. My DH was/is a full on boobs man, not in a gross way (in fact it was many months into our relationship before i figured this out as he would never have said anything himself) but still, he likes boobs.

Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.

And he's a keeper. SO I figure all the voices screaming "be discreet, cover up, stay at home" have similar or stronger feelings than him but are happy to vocalise it more.

Neither of my GMs breastfed, the government provided them with formula and bottles. My Mum didn't breastfeed. I am the first person in my family in 3 generations to breastfeed. That's a whole lot of influence to undo and i imagine it will take more than 3 generations since it isn't government sponsored.

Sigh.


Interesting about your DH. My husband is the opposite "any boobs are good" LOL Perhaps he is an odd one out though, he dosen't care there is a baby on the other end.

I understand the gist though on another forum there were all these people  up in arms about it, and not one could actually explain by it offended them so much.



#12 DiamondKat

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:17 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 09:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual. If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to. Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids. And it's all about them and their needs of course.


I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

#13 (feral)epg

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:31 AM

I wonder if part of it is that breastfeeding boobs are actually a very different species to sexy boobs?
Think about how different the boobs in pornos or on models look compared to those pendulous large nippled things we use to feed our children.  I think some men find this deflation of their fantasies quite disturbing.


#14 Guest_Sunnycat_*

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:32 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 10:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.


I agree with this in general. Of course there are always going to be people who have a problem with any boob whether it's breastfeeding or in bathers or in a low cut top, but I think in general this is the crux of the matter. Most people are happy for boobs to be on display if they're fashionable, or in magazines etc but not breastfeeding.

I don't understand this "I don't want to see YOUR boob/nipple", dont look then. Simple.

#15 BetteBoop

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:38 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 09:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.


Bingo.

Sex is about largely about fantasy. No one imagines a person they find attractive performing basic bodily functions like eating, sh*tting or blowing their nose or having a period. They don't like to think of them as a food production source either.

Woman are fundamentally perceived as sexual things. The idea that we make food ruins the fantasy.

#16 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:43 AM

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

You could put a blanket over your head. That would prevent a stray nipple crossing your vision.

#17 50ftqueenie

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:45 AM

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.


You know what?  I don't particularly want to flash my nipples either, but FFS they are not to be put in the same category of stomach churning images that put people off their food.  


#18 erypmaV

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:49 AM

QUOTE (Lolpigs @ 22/01/2013, 11:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My husband is the opposite "any boobs are good" LOL Perhaps he is an odd one out though.

He's right and he's not the odd one out original.gif



#19 Feral_Pooks

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:51 AM

Weird isn't it. I find my neck to be more of a sexual thing that the bazoongas, but I don't feel the need to cover it up.

There are plenty of things I don't particularly like looking at but I don't expect people to change just for me. Like people wearing their pants halfway down their a*se. I mightn't like it, but tough.

#20 Aimee_87

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:53 AM

Seeing a baby eating their food puts you off your food?! Stay home to eat your meals if you're so precious!  And with that, I give up on this topic.

Maybe I will take my daughter to a cafe for lunch today... What do you think will p*** the other patrons off more, letting her scream because she's hungry, or letting her have some lunch with rest of the human race?!?

#21 CallMeFeral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:55 AM

QUOTE (countrymel @ 22/01/2013, 10:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hey everyone else had theirs out I am nothing if not a follower!

Unfortunately my glaringly white breasts with their tiny pink nipples were even more interesting apparently than my curly blonde hair! (which had been getting quite a workout - it's hilarious apparently!)

My boyfriend of the time returned to the village and was highly amused to seem me surrounded by a gaggle of women who were all taking turns to cup my breasts in their hands and speak earnestly among themselves..  

I swear there was only 5 people there when I arrived, by the time he turned up there were about 30!


Ah... happy days, happy days!


Dead
Set
Legend

That is all.

QUOTE (Dinosaurus @ 22/01/2013, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.


That is a shame sad.gif  Not blaming him, but it is sad. I think it's a bit like those guys you occasionally hear about who see their wives give birth and then can't think of the vagina the same way.
Dude's, we're multiskilled!
I do find it weird though. I mean all of us pee out of or around our sexual organs, and the whole defacation thing doesn't seem to put a lot of people off anal sex. Can't get much grosser multipurposing than that - lot worse than making food!
But you don't get people getting colostomy bags because their vulvas/penises should just be for sex. I guess that dichotomy is programmed in from birth and people accept it. I guess too many young boys have been brought up thinking breasts are an entertainment not a functional item. Newsflash - most things on our bodies are functional!

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

Have you delved deeper into why though? I mean objectively, noses are probably grosser. Ears are not crash hot. Fingernails... moles... mouths are positively gross if you look at them objectively.
What's so displeasing about a raised area of different coloured skin? Unless you've been taught to regard it as some sort of genitalia...

#22 Mama8

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:57 AM

My man is a boob man and he thinks breastfeeding mums are great.
We have apprentices that often have babies on the way and he always tells them how good breastfeeding is and how portable the babies are without bottles.

He sees them as functional as well as sexual but not at the same time ifkwim?
He doesn't see me feeding the baby and think " damn that's sexy" he thinks " that's a beautiful sight" but if I walk in with a towel and no baby then it's sexy lol.

I see breastfeeding as another job mums do and it's just like feeding your older children.
I don't want praise or put downs, it's natural.

I often use " they are only boobs, what's the big deal? Everyone has them and the dog has 10" laughing2.gif


#23 Aimee_87

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:01 AM

But back to the original topic before I was filled with
QUOTE
rage... Yes I think perhaps for some men seeing breastfeeding does ruin the mystique of the boob as a sexual object, but that doesn't explain why many women (including mothers) are so offended by it.

#24 Mrs Dinosaurus

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:06 AM

I think I may have done my DH a disservice.

He still likes my boobs, but him putting his mouth on my nipple while we are ... he doesn't like. He wont do. He joins babies milk with babies which is not sexy.

I have no doubt when I'm not leaking milk everywhere he will happily 'reclaim' them for his sex life laughing2.gif

But I get what you mean, he also sees BF as beautiful and natural and not sexy but he thinks different thoughts in different context - low cut top on big boobs = oh wow, boobs, omg boobs, didyouallseetheboobsit'slikeineversawaboobbeforewowthisisawesome...

Breastfeeding - he doesn't see the boob at all. It's just eating to him.

Dude that anal sex analogy was blerky for those of us multi-tasking with food right now!!

#25 briandrea

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:08 AM

QUOTE
He sees them as functional as well as sexual but not at the same time ifkwim?
He doesn't see me feeding the baby and think " damn that's sexy" he thinks " that's a beautiful sight" but if I walk in with a towel and no baby then it's sexy lol

My husband is the same. He is able to seperate the functionallity from sexuality when looking at breasts.

As another poster mentioned almost all our body parts are multi-functional. One of the biggest are our mouths and fingers and yet they're on display ALL THE TIME! Think about it wink.gif

In response to the OP and talking about different cultures, I think it's a great point to bring up. We are conditioned in our culture in this day in age to view womens bodies in a certain way. If we were to go back 150 years men would have been getting aroused by the sight of a womans wrists or ankles as she wore high neck, long sleeved, long dresses. We have to consider this in context.

I breastfed my son for over 2 years and he has recently self-weaned. I'm sure a few people saw my nipple in that time although it wouldn't have been for more than a mili-second as my child latched on. I really hope that the more women feel comfortable breastfeeding in public, the more our children will grow seeing breasts in the way they should be - primarily a functional body part that can also be used for sexual purposes - and hopefully debates like we have seen in the last week will be a thing of the past.




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