Jump to content

topless nudity
also about breast feeding sorry!


  • Please log in to reply
63 replies to this topic

#1 Excentrique Feral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:16 AM

All this breastfeeding argument has got me thinking about tribes and native societies. Often in these more remote communities women only wear a skirt or similar. The breasts are not covered. Women are seen feeding all the time without any part of the area covered and no-one seems offended.

Maybe the issue is that breasts in western society are overly sexualised, and that is why everyone gets so offended by public breastfeeding. Or do the men in these cultures get annoyed when they see the women feeding their babies outside the hut?? lol.

WDYT?

#2 CountryFeral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:24 AM

In cultures where breasts are exposed in traditional clothing you will generally find that it is the female backside that is the erotic, highly sexually charged area.

So wandering around in your short shorts and a smock  is obscene.. bare breasts and a skirt you are ok.  


(although if your breasts are a different colour to the regular breasts on show you will still find yourself the centre of a lot of attention!  *please note voice of bitter experience in posting*)

#3 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:40 AM

Countrymel, That requires more explanation.

Yes, I think there is this false idea that breasts are sexual, so some people can't separate out the functional aspect. They see babies feeding as sexual, primitive, uncouth.

#4 I'm Batman

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:42 AM

oh Mel, did you put on a show?


hahahhahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhahahhahahahhahahahhahahhahahhahahahahhahah



#5 CountryFeral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:48 AM

Hey everyone else had theirs out I am nothing if not a follower!

Unfortunately my glaringly white breasts with their tiny pink nipples were even more interesting apparently than my curly blonde hair! (which had been getting quite a workout - it's hilarious apparently!)

My boyfriend of the time returned to the village and was highly amused to seem me surrounded by a gaggle of women who were all taking turns to cup my breasts in their hands and speak earnestly among themselves..  

I swear there was only 5 people there when I arrived, by the time he turned up there were about 30!


Ah... happy days, happy days!

#6 FeralBob!

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:49 AM

It's not a false idea that breasts are sexual, that is what their primary purpose in western society is. I'm not sure how it happened, but the dominant narrative in western society is that breasts are there for the titillation of men. That's why we have page 3 girls, that's why we have push up bras, cosmetic boob jobs, low cut tops, men yelling out "show us your tits" or "get your boys out for the boys".

It's also why so many men, and women, find it so deeply disturbing when they see breasts being used for their biological purpose, ie feeding the young of our species. And when you combine into that the fact that for the last few generations, bottlefeeding was promoted as being much better than breastfeeding (thus allowing no dilution of the "breasts are for men" idea), you can sort of understand, although NOT agree with, where their minds are at.

#7 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:53 AM

My bad, bob, I should have said "only" sexual.

Mel, that is hilarious. I wonder what they were saying.  laugh.gif

#8 sarkazm76

Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:57 AM

I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.



#9 FeralBob!

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:00 AM

No probs, Riotproof, I did think it was a leetle unusual of you to have phrased it that way.

Lol, Mel, they were probably exclaiming about the whiteness, and the little nipples and wondering if they'd do the job wink.gif

#10 Mrs Dinosaurus

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:11 AM

Mel that is an awesome story.

I agree with Bob. My DH was/is a full on boobs man, not in a gross way (in fact it was many months into our relationship before i figured this out as he would never have said anything himself) but still, he likes boobs.

Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.

And he's a keeper. SO I figure all the voices screaming "be discreet, cover up, stay at home" have similar or stronger feelings than him but are happy to vocalise it more.

Neither of my GMs breastfed, the government provided them with formula and bottles. My Mum didn't breastfeed. I am the first person in my family in 3 generations to breastfeed. That's a whole lot of influence to undo and i imagine it will take more than 3 generations since it isn't government sponsored.

Sigh.



#11 Lolpigs

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:15 AM

QUOTE (Dinosaurus @ 22/01/2013, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Mel that is an awesome story.

I agree with Bob. My DH was/is a full on boobs man, not in a gross way (in fact it was many months into our relationship before i figured this out as he would never have said anything himself) but still, he likes boobs.

Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.

And he's a keeper. SO I figure all the voices screaming "be discreet, cover up, stay at home" have similar or stronger feelings than him but are happy to vocalise it more.

Neither of my GMs breastfed, the government provided them with formula and bottles. My Mum didn't breastfeed. I am the first person in my family in 3 generations to breastfeed. That's a whole lot of influence to undo and i imagine it will take more than 3 generations since it isn't government sponsored.

Sigh.


Interesting about your DH. My husband is the opposite "any boobs are good" LOL Perhaps he is an odd one out though, he dosen't care there is a baby on the other end.

I understand the gist though on another forum there were all these people  up in arms about it, and not one could actually explain by it offended them so much.



#12 DiamondKat

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:17 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 09:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual. If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to. Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids. And it's all about them and their needs of course.


I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

#13 (feral)epg

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:31 AM

I wonder if part of it is that breastfeeding boobs are actually a very different species to sexy boobs?
Think about how different the boobs in pornos or on models look compared to those pendulous large nippled things we use to feed our children.  I think some men find this deflation of their fantasies quite disturbing.


#14 Guest_Sunnycat_*

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:32 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 10:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.


I agree with this in general. Of course there are always going to be people who have a problem with any boob whether it's breastfeeding or in bathers or in a low cut top, but I think in general this is the crux of the matter. Most people are happy for boobs to be on display if they're fashionable, or in magazines etc but not breastfeeding.

I don't understand this "I don't want to see YOUR boob/nipple", dont look then. Simple.

#15 BetteBoop

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:38 AM

QUOTE (sarkazm76 @ 22/01/2013, 09:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I had this same realisation yesterday - men and some women don't want to see women breastfeeding because they want breasts to remain solely sexual.  If they see a baby suckling on a boob it makes them uncomfortable because they cannot take their perception of the sexual boob out of their mind - and they don't want to.  Because sex is far more enjoyable for them then you feeding your kids.  And it's all about them and their needs of course.


Bingo.

Sex is about largely about fantasy. No one imagines a person they find attractive performing basic bodily functions like eating, sh*tting or blowing their nose or having a period. They don't like to think of them as a food production source either.

Woman are fundamentally perceived as sexual things. The idea that we make food ruins the fantasy.

#16 Riotproof

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:43 AM

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

You could put a blanket over your head. That would prevent a stray nipple crossing your vision.

#17 50ftqueenie

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:45 AM

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I disagree with this.  I don't want to see boobs, regardless of what they're doing but I don't want them to remain sexual, in fact I don't really consider them sexually unless they're displayed that way (nudie mags etc) to me they're just extra fat storage.  I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.


You know what?  I don't particularly want to flash my nipples either, but FFS they are not to be put in the same category of stomach churning images that put people off their food.  


#18 erypmaV

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:49 AM

QUOTE (Lolpigs @ 22/01/2013, 11:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
My husband is the opposite "any boobs are good" LOL Perhaps he is an odd one out though.

He's right and he's not the odd one out original.gif



#19 Feral_Pooks

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:51 AM

Weird isn't it. I find my neck to be more of a sexual thing that the bazoongas, but I don't feel the need to cover it up.

There are plenty of things I don't particularly like looking at but I don't expect people to change just for me. Like people wearing their pants halfway down their a*se. I mightn't like it, but tough.

#20 Aimee_87

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:53 AM

Seeing a baby eating their food puts you off your food?! Stay home to eat your meals if you're so precious!  And with that, I give up on this topic.

Maybe I will take my daughter to a cafe for lunch today... What do you think will p*** the other patrons off more, letting her scream because she's hungry, or letting her have some lunch with rest of the human race?!?

#21 CallMeFeral

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:55 AM

QUOTE (countrymel @ 22/01/2013, 10:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hey everyone else had theirs out I am nothing if not a follower!

Unfortunately my glaringly white breasts with their tiny pink nipples were even more interesting apparently than my curly blonde hair! (which had been getting quite a workout - it's hilarious apparently!)

My boyfriend of the time returned to the village and was highly amused to seem me surrounded by a gaggle of women who were all taking turns to cup my breasts in their hands and speak earnestly among themselves..  

I swear there was only 5 people there when I arrived, by the time he turned up there were about 30!


Ah... happy days, happy days!


Dead
Set
Legend

That is all.

QUOTE (Dinosaurus @ 22/01/2013, 11:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Since I have been BF almost constantly for the last 3 1/2 years he wont have a bar of them being sexy, he says they're not for that any more - like BF has somehow broken the joy he used to get from them.

Don't get me wrong, I have a wonderful DH who I adore and respect and visa versa, he is a feminist and completely agrees with all my BF, extended BF, public BF whatever - but there is a part of him that feels that loss.


That is a shame sad.gif  Not blaming him, but it is sad. I think it's a bit like those guys you occasionally hear about who see their wives give birth and then can't think of the vagina the same way.
Dude's, we're multiskilled!
I do find it weird though. I mean all of us pee out of or around our sexual organs, and the whole defacation thing doesn't seem to put a lot of people off anal sex. Can't get much grosser multipurposing than that - lot worse than making food!
But you don't get people getting colostomy bags because their vulvas/penises should just be for sex. I guess that dichotomy is programmed in from birth and people accept it. I guess too many young boys have been brought up thinking breasts are an entertainment not a functional item. Newsflash - most things on our bodies are functional!

QUOTE (DiamondKat @ 22/01/2013, 11:17 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't have a problem with breastfeeding, although I'd like to not see any nipple while I'm eating my lunch/dinner it's just that I don't find them particularly pleasing to look at, especially with food.

Have you delved deeper into why though? I mean objectively, noses are probably grosser. Ears are not crash hot. Fingernails... moles... mouths are positively gross if you look at them objectively.
What's so displeasing about a raised area of different coloured skin? Unless you've been taught to regard it as some sort of genitalia...

#22 Mama8

Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:57 AM

My man is a boob man and he thinks breastfeeding mums are great.
We have apprentices that often have babies on the way and he always tells them how good breastfeeding is and how portable the babies are without bottles.

He sees them as functional as well as sexual but not at the same time ifkwim?
He doesn't see me feeding the baby and think " damn that's sexy" he thinks " that's a beautiful sight" but if I walk in with a towel and no baby then it's sexy lol.

I see breastfeeding as another job mums do and it's just like feeding your older children.
I don't want praise or put downs, it's natural.

I often use " they are only boobs, what's the big deal? Everyone has them and the dog has 10" laughing2.gif


#23 Aimee_87

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:01 AM

But back to the original topic before I was filled with
QUOTE
rage... Yes I think perhaps for some men seeing breastfeeding does ruin the mystique of the boob as a sexual object, but that doesn't explain why many women (including mothers) are so offended by it.

#24 Mrs Dinosaurus

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:06 AM

I think I may have done my DH a disservice.

He still likes my boobs, but him putting his mouth on my nipple while we are ... he doesn't like. He wont do. He joins babies milk with babies which is not sexy.

I have no doubt when I'm not leaking milk everywhere he will happily 'reclaim' them for his sex life laughing2.gif

But I get what you mean, he also sees BF as beautiful and natural and not sexy but he thinks different thoughts in different context - low cut top on big boobs = oh wow, boobs, omg boobs, didyouallseetheboobsit'slikeineversawaboobbeforewowthisisawesome...

Breastfeeding - he doesn't see the boob at all. It's just eating to him.

Dude that anal sex analogy was blerky for those of us multi-tasking with food right now!!

#25 briandrea

Posted 22 January 2013 - 11:08 AM

QUOTE
He sees them as functional as well as sexual but not at the same time ifkwim?
He doesn't see me feeding the baby and think " damn that's sexy" he thinks " that's a beautiful sight" but if I walk in with a towel and no baby then it's sexy lol

My husband is the same. He is able to seperate the functionallity from sexuality when looking at breasts.

As another poster mentioned almost all our body parts are multi-functional. One of the biggest are our mouths and fingers and yet they're on display ALL THE TIME! Think about it wink.gif

In response to the OP and talking about different cultures, I think it's a great point to bring up. We are conditioned in our culture in this day in age to view womens bodies in a certain way. If we were to go back 150 years men would have been getting aroused by the sight of a womans wrists or ankles as she wore high neck, long sleeved, long dresses. We have to consider this in context.

I breastfed my son for over 2 years and he has recently self-weaned. I'm sure a few people saw my nipple in that time although it wouldn't have been for more than a mili-second as my child latched on. I really hope that the more women feel comfortable breastfeeding in public, the more our children will grow seeing breasts in the way they should be - primarily a functional body part that can also be used for sexual purposes - and hopefully debates like we have seen in the last week will be a thing of the past.




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users

 

Special offer: The Baby & Toddler Show 2014

At The Baby & Toddler Show, you?ll find everything you need to get ready for your new arrival and guide you through the early weeks and years of parenting.

An open letter to Tony Abbott: please salvage our super

We face financial ruin, but most of us don?t realise it. If we don?t act together to salvage our superannuation, I have no doubt the new GFC will be the Girls? Financial Crisis.

'I'm happy to know I'm changing lives': surrogate mum of two

I know that once the baby is born, I will focus on the gift I have given, and watch the parents with their new child. I can't wait for that day.

Birth trauma and the issue of informed consent

There is a perception that women should just be happy they have a healthy baby in their arms. But for women who experienced birth trauma, there's a lot more to it.

Tips for managing pollen allergies and hayfever

They're simple tips, but they can have a big impact on those who suffer from hayfever and pollen allergies.

Ada Nicodemou shares tribute to her stillborn baby

Just over one month since Ada Nicodemou and her husband lost their second son, the Home and Away star has shared a touching poem for her baby.

Mum causes stir breastfeeding on train

?To the woman breastfeeding her kid on the train. Seriously! On the train?" began the letter of complaint.

10 things they don?t tell you about being pregnant

As I slowly waddle my ever-changing pregnant body towards the finishing line of my due date, it?s becoming increasingly clear there are a lot of things they just don?t tell you about pregnancy.

Overcoming a fear of the dark

A toddler's fear of the dark is very normal, but there are ways parents can help children through this stage in their development.

Kids, TV and movies: how young is too young?

It seems you don't have to throw the TV and iPad out the window - it all boils down to moderation, supervision and interaction.

Video: Baby's first birthday is a special day for mum, too

?A baby?s first birthday is also mum?s first birthday.?

The day Supernanny came to tea

Prince William's favourite celebrity child trainer Jo Frost puts Bryony Gordon and her toddler through their paces.

Tales from the homefront

When you're at work you sort of assume that your house is basically just sitting there quietly doing nothing until you return. However, since spending my days at home, I've learned this couldn't be further from the truth.

The words I hated hearing as new mum

It was less than a week after my son was born that I first heard it - from my mother.

To the pharmacist who sold me baby formula

On the rare occasion I catch sight of you at school, or around town, I think back to our earliest exchange. I?m sure you have no recollection of it at all.

Babies may benefit from autism therapy

Children showing signs of autism don't usually receive early intervention until well into toddlerhood or later, but a new study suggests infants with symptoms of the developmental disorder might benefit from therapy from as early as six months.

Knatalye and Adeline born with an everlasting bond

Knatalye Hope and Adeline Faith are a lot like any other identical twin girls, but there is one dramatic difference: they're joined at the chest and shares several internal organs.

The question this dad wishes he'd asked his wife

I should have seen that my wife wasn't the same person I'd fallen in love with, but we were both too focused on simply trying to get by.

Why we should talk about the deaths of the Hunt children

The deaths are too horrible even to think about. Yet we owe it to the children - Fletcher, Mia and Phoebe Hunt - to think long and hard about it all.

Baby dies of meningococcal weeks after vaccine application denied

A six-month-old girl has died from meningococcal disease just weeks after an application for government funding of a vaccine for the most deadly strain of the virus was rejected.

Finding the right balance when playing with your kids

Being too involved in our children?s play and not allowing our kids enough free time for unstructured activities can mean our kids miss out on the value that play offers.

Creative DIY light shades

The Pop Light light shade comes in a flat pack already made - it's up to you to design it as you'd like.

The battle of iParenting versus imagination

Have we forgotten how to be imaginative, resourceful parents?

Why movement is so important for your baby's growth

Letting your child move as much as possible in the early years ? using all senses, engaging in the real world, preferably outside ? will help them grow up healthier, smarter, calmer and stronger.

Download now: Essential Kids Activity Finder app

Got bored kids? Quickly find the best activities for kids wherever you are in Australia with the Essential Kids app.

 
Advertisement
 

Top 5 Articles

Advertisement
 
 
 

What's hot on EB

Special offer: The Baby & Toddler Show 2014

At The Baby & Toddler Show, you?ll find everything you need to get ready for your new arrival and guide you through the early weeks and years of parenting.

Losing yourself to motherhood

While watching your baby grow into a unique little person is exciting and wondrous, the intensity of meeting everyone else?s needs can ever so sneakily overtake your own needs for self-care.

Tearing during delivery: the facts

Almost all women will experience bruising, grazing or tearing after a vaginal birth. Depending on the degree of tearing, there are various treatments available.

6 tips for a day out with a baby and toddler

Outings can be lots of fun with the kids, but there are inevitable challenges. Here's some information about days out to help you be a little more prepared.

Why I invited a dozen people to watch my son's birth

I sent invitations on burgundy scrapbooking paper stamped with a field of poppies, and told each person why I wanted him or her there. I warned that there would be nudity.

Getting labour started: tips for a natural induction

When your baby?s due date comes and goes without so much as a pop - let alone a bang - it can be disheartening. Mums and a doula share their stories of natural inductions.

7 mistakes old hands make with new babies

As I sat across the table from my friend ? me, a seasoned mother of three; her, a brand new mum ? I thought of all the mistakes an old-hand parent can make when visiting a newborn baby.

That's my boy: a dad's diary of the first 4 months

Unbearable anxiety, unspeakable joy, constant exhaustion and bouts of frustration ... The many shocks of first-time fatherhood resound in a dad's diary of his son's early months.

One of the most important things a new mum can do

Finances may not be as cute as a newborn, but with many women?s working arrangements changing post-baby, monetary matters need attention too.

Baby survives five days alone

He lay with his mother for up to five days after she died of a suspected drug overdose - and survived.

Personalised baby gifts

We've scoured the internet to find gorgeous personalised keepsakes and nursery decor to record baby name and dates. They make great gifts for christenings, name days and birthdays! (All prices in AU.)

 

Reader offer

2 FOR 1 TICKET OFFER

For Shopping, For Advice, For Baby & You. Enjoy a special day out with fabulous shopping from over 200 brands, leading parenting experts offering advice on a range of topics, and amazing children?s entertainment

 
Advertisement
 
 
Essential Baby and Essential Kids is the place to find parenting information and parenting support relating to conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids, maternity, family budgeting, family travel, nutrition and wellbeing, family entertainment, kids entertainment, tips for the family home, child-friendly recipes and parenting. Try our pregnancy due date calculator to determine your due date, or our ovulation calculator to predict ovulation and your fertile period. Our pregnancy week by week guide shows your baby's stages of development. Access our very active mum's discussion groups in the Essential Baby forums or the Essential Kids forums to talk to mums about conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids and parenting lifestyle. Essential Baby also offers a baby names database of more than 22,000 baby names, popular baby names, boys' names, girls' names and baby names advice in our baby names forum. Essential Kids features a range of free printable worksheets for kids from preschool years through to primary school years. For the latest baby clothes, maternity clothes, maternity accessories, toddler products, kids toys and kids clothing, breastfeeding and other parenting resources, check out Essential Baby and Essential Kids.