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Extremely frustrated with 1 yr olds nocturnal adventures


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#1 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:17 PM

I have posted on EB before about my little girls sleep problems and here i am yet again!!  probably more of a vent than anything else im just so tired and over it.

She is 12 months old and is quite  a delightful little girl, she goes down for her two day naps easily, i put her down awake, she grizzles for a  bit, then goes off to sleep clutching her bunny for a few good hours.

At night time though?  it all changes.  Some nights, and what i hoped was becoming the regular pattern was she slept from 7pm til 4 ish, then into bed with me for a breast feed and more dozing til 6.30 ish.  Fine.  Lately however she has taken to waking up at midnight and screaming the house down.  She isnt sick, isnt thirty, or hot/cold , there has been no major change happening.  She will scream blue murder for hours on end whether we hold her, pat her, rock her, sing, leave her for a bit.  NOTHING WORKS except, boobs.  Problem is though a breastfeed settles her, but the minute i take it out she starts up the screaming again sad.gif  I cant sleep the whole night through with her attached to my nipple.  I dont mind her sleeping with me, but not attached to me.  

My 4 year old daughter is in the room with her too and my DH isnt well at the moment, so for the last few nights i have resorted to letting her feed all night long sad.gif  meaning little (and very uncomfortable) night sleep for me.


What to do?  Will it get better?  aghhhhhhhhhhh

#2 caitiri

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:27 PM

I know you said that she goes down quite easily but could she be waking up becuse she is not tired.  One of my kids does this if he has a nap he is either very late or he  wakes up in the middle of the night ready to go.



#3 au*lit

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:34 PM

Sorry to hear this - sleep deprivation sucks.

Is it possible she's teething? Have you tried a bit of Bonjela? Around that age my DS's first molars came through.

Otherwise, around the same age we started having real trouble with night feeds. Constant waking, wanting to feed constantly, it was sending me bonkers. Eventually we night weaned which mostly solved the problem, but this involved DH getting up and resettling him which sounds like it's not possible for you at the moment.

Have you tried any techniques from the No Cry Sleep Solution, like the Pantley pull-off.  It basically means weaning the baby off feeding to sleep for comfort.

#4 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:36 PM

thanks for your response Caitiri,

It makes sense..but  I dont think i can cut out the day sleeps yet..actually last night was the worst night yet and she only had one (rather short) day sleep, so i though the waking might have been due to over tiredness!  oh God, i dont know.


she is soooo ready for a nap by 9am  (i cant cut that out yet)..and then she is cranky and irritable/tired again at 2 ish. so another nap is needed here..and then, by 7 or 7.30 ish she is totally  sleepy and ready for bed.  Why the midnight party/feed/scream fest?!?! cry1.gif



#5 BeYOUtiful

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:36 PM

What time are her day sleeps and how long are each?

Could she be teething?

#6 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

QUOTE
Eventually we night weaned which mostly solved the problem, but this involved DH getting up and resettling him which sounds like it's not possible for you at the moment.


Yep, at about 9 months ,  i got terribly run down and ended up with a shocking dose of tonsiliitis and wasnt getting any sleep with the night feed marathons so we did the whole night weaning thing with me unconscious in the spare room and DH dealing with the baby.  After a few nights we got a massive improvement but lately she has reverted for some reason and before DH got sick he was trying to deal with it but she is much more strong willed now she just screams and screams and screams till our ears and our wits are at breaking point,  so yeah, thats why ive resorted back to the night feeding and feeling very defeated!

I will take a look at the no cry sleep solution.. it sounds nice to me!


#7 Escapin

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

I night weaned DD about the same age. She wasn't very impressed, but it only took a few days to get past. I would pick her up, say 'no more boob for Lizzie, sorry darling.' Cuddle for up to 2 minutes (or pat or whatever you do) then back into her cot. Say goodnight and walk out. Count to 30. If she's still yelling, go back in and repeat. The most it ever took was 10 rounds, which is only 30 minutes.

Good luck, you just need to stick to your guns. i would also do the same for the 4:30 wakeup, so you can get a proper night's sleep.

#8 rosiebird

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:42 PM

I. Hear. You.
No advice, just sympathy and the vaguely comforting knowledge that someone else is having their nipple sucked dry all night too. 2hrs from midnight to 2am - then 2 hours from 3am-5am. Screamed every time she was detached. Combined with the horizontal sleep position (head under my armpit, feet on DH's head), co-sleeping with a toddler is so much harder than with a baby!

#9 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:48 PM

In regards to Teething yeah i think so, she does look to be having some more teeth coming in, but we have tried giving her nurofen but havnt noticed any change/improvement with pain relief.

The 2 day sleeps are about 9am:  1-1.5 hrs.   and another one at 2pm for same amount of time.  She is up for the day by 6 or 6.30am most days

#10 AntiBourgeoisie

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:52 PM

Sounds like she is uncomfortable. Teething gets blamed for everything. The reality is all babies have these unsettled phases that people often find no answer for.
Midnight is not a typical time to wake up for 'behavioral' reasons and therefore controlled crying/comforting etc is unlikely to work at this juncture (wakings at 2 am and 4-5 am are more typically 'behavioral'. So the bad news is that something very real is upsetting your baby (though you may never find out what it is). The good news is that it's unlikely to be permanent, or require intense 'sleep training' to resolve.
I suggest some panadol and nurofen at bedtime, and more panadol when she wakes at midnight. I have no idea if she's in pain, but both panadol and nurofen are so safe it's easy to cover that base. Put some Bonjela on when she wakes (also hit and miss, but safe). And then do what you need - rock, pat, feed. And try to get some assistance during the day so you can get some rest too.
She will be extra tired because she is also not sleeping! Now is not the time to cut back her naps; rather try to encourage as much napping as possible.
If this doesn't pass in a week to ten days, or she develops any other symptoms, take her to your GP. Odds are it will pass in a week or so.
If she has developed a sleep association with breastfeeding in this time, you'll know because she'll wake cranky either frequently, or at those behavioural windows at 2 am and/or 4-5 am. If this happens, it might need a few extra nights of your preferred method of sleep 'training' to 'correct'. But don't try that until this extreme period passes.
And if you feel like it's all too much, leave her in the room for ten minutes and walk out, get some fresh air. Your baby will not suffer. Take care if yourself too.
Good luck! This too will pass!

#11 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:54 PM

QUOTE
I. Hear. You.
No advice, just sympathy and the vaguely comforting knowledge that someone else is having their nipple sucked dry all night too. 2hrs from midnight to 2am - then 2 hours from 3am-5am. Screamed every time she was detached. Combined with the horizontal sleep position (head under my armpit, feet on DH's head), co-sleeping with a toddler is so much harder than with a baby!


Sorry to hear that Rosie bird sad.gif   How old is your little one?  have you tried any of the above suggestions?

#12 AntiBourgeoisie

Posted 17 January 2013 - 09:58 PM

Also - now is not the time to night wean. Let this acute phase pass, then reassess.
I suspect many night weaning/sleep training 'failures' occur because things are plodding along and just tolerable, then something acute like this happens which makes parents go 'right, must fix this' and they embark on a crusade instantly. Wrong time. Something (teeth, sore ear, developmental spurt, whatever) is upsetting your baby. Now is a time for comfort, not more radical change. It's a scenario doomed to failure.
Let this pass. Reassess and see where you are with it all. Babies change after these periods. You may go back to a level of night feeding you are happy to provide. Or it may get worse. Either way, wait a few weeks before attempting to do something about it.

#13 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:00 PM

Great advice Anti B, thanks  original.gif

It does make sense actually as when i was attempting to let her just settle herself  (and letting me cool off for ten minutes) she was getting so extremely worked up , there was no way she was self settling.

Something is up and its very frustrating not knowing what!

Edited by bettymm, 17 January 2013 - 10:02 PM.


#14 rosiebird

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:02 PM

QUOTE (AntiBourgeoisie @ 17/01/2013, 09:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Also - now is not the time to night wean. Let this acute phase pass, then reassess.
I suspect many night weaning/sleep training 'failures' occur because things are plodding along and just tolerable, then something acute like this happens which makes parents go 'right, must fix this' and they embark on a crusade instantly. Wrong time. Something (teeth, sore ear, developmental spurt, whatever) is upsetting your baby. Now is a time for comfort, not more radical change. It's a scenario doomed to failure.
Let this pass. Reassess and see where you are with it all. Babies change after these periods. You may go back to a level of night feeding you are happy to provide. Or it may get worse. Either way, wait a few weeks before attempting to do something about it.


I'm going to take this advice too. My DD is 13 months. I always say I'm going to sleep train when it gets this bad and then everything goes back to an acceptable level of sleep deprivation (2-3 brief wake ups) and I don't have the heart to do it.

#15 au*lit

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:08 PM

To add to what Anti Bourgeoisie has said above, we went through night weaning two or three times. Each time the night feeding started up because he was ill, or 'something' (didn't always know what) had him unsettled or waking at night. So I'd feed to resettle him. But then once he was well again he was back in the habit of waking for a feed. Sometimes he started sleeping through on his own, but a few times we needed to break the habit.

#16 bettymm

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:09 PM

QUOTE
I always say I'm going to sleep train when it gets this bad and then everything goes back to an acceptable level of sleep deprivation (2-3 brief wake ups) and I don't have the heart to do it.


Same here!  I was quite happy with our cosleep feeding 4am-6 am arrangements but I have told others who cant believe i survive on that.  Then this happens and i think yep, i really do need to do something drastic! and get all fired up but im glad i read Ant B's advice.  Best to ride out this acute phase of whatever and then see what happens.

Edited to add:  i am so glad i posted this tonight..i was feeling so down and now i feel i can handle whatever she throws at me tonight!  thanks so much , amazing what a new fresh perspective can offer original.gif

Edited by bettymm, 17 January 2013 - 10:12 PM.


#17 AntiBourgeoisie

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:17 PM

QUOTE (bettymm @ 17/01/2013, 11:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Edited to add:  i am so glad i posted this tonight..i was feeling so down and now i feel i can handle whatever she throws at me tonight!  thanks so much , amazing what a new fresh perspective can offer original.gif



Really pleased to hear that!

#18 winkywonkeydonkey

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:22 PM

QUOTE (bettymm @ 17/01/2013, 09:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
What to do?  Will it get better?  aghhhhhhhhhhh


The only way for me was to wean. Sorry. Not sure if thats an option for you yet.

My dd started doing this at the  same age and i lasted until 21 months until the sleep deprivation got too much.She was just using me as a dummy and i couldnt cope on no sleep anymore.

#19 BeYOUtiful

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:31 PM

I promise you it gets better OP. My son was waking 3hrly at that age but when it ramped up to hourly (like when he was younger) it was teeth.  Only feeding soothed him as well.

He Co slept when he was getting 4 eye teeth at once.

He now sleeps through and I never thought it would happen after 2yrs of waking.

I hope you manage some rest.


#20 BeYOUtiful

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:32 PM

I promise you it gets better OP. My son was waking 3hrly at that age but when it ramped up to hourly (like when he was younger) it was teeth.  Only feeding soothed him as well.

He Co slept when he was getting 4 eye teeth at once.

He now sleeps through and I never thought it would happen after 2yrs of waking.

I hope you manage some rest.


#21 BeYOUtiful

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:33 PM

I promise you it gets better OP. My son was waking 3hrly at that age but when it ramped up to hourly (like when he was younger) it was teeth.  Only feeding soothed him as well.

He Co slept when he was getting 4 eye teeth at once.

He now sleeps through and I never thought it would happen after 2yrs of waking.

I hope you manage some rest.


#22 Starrydawn

Posted 17 January 2013 - 10:48 PM

Yes around that age DD started waking screaming as well. Nothing worked. She hated sleeping with me so had to eventually just put her back in cot and try to soothe her to sleep.

She needed her day naps as well. Still needs the one as well. It did eventually pass.




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