Jump to content

Is this normal? Baby massage class seemed weird


  • Please log in to reply
81 replies to this topic

#1 OneProudMum

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:21 PM

A couple of weeks after the birth of DD we went along to a baby massage class ran by the hospital.

In the massage class we were taught that at the beginning of every massage we need to ask our babies if they give consent to being massaged. They said that as time progresses our children will be able to give an answer in an age appropriate manner. They then went on to say that we should carry this same principle to bath and nappy time, to foster some sort of trust so that they can learn that they can say no.

Is this a typical thing? I don't ask my children if I can wash them! Well, DS washes himself anyway.

Thoughts?

Edited by OneProudMum, 05 January 2013 - 01:47 PM.


#2 Expelliarmus

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:27 PM

I heard that as well - not at a massage class, just 'in general'. I never bought into it. They learned to say no and we built trust without me asking them every single time I touched them.

#3 rosiebird

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:27 PM

Not weird. I used to say "massage honey?" or "do you want a massage sweetheart?" in a questioning voice, and stop if she started to squirm or look upset. I didn't ask "would it be permissible to massage your feet?" or anything stupid like that, but I think it's a good reminder that your baby is a separate person with wants and desires, even if she is rather small, and it stops you from "doing things to" rather than "doing things with" your baby. Don't say anything if its not natural to you, the important thing is being sensitive and responsive to your baby.

#4 TillyTake2

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:29 PM

I'd "ask" for something like a massage but not for a nappy lol. If you need a nappy change you NEED a nappy change.

#5 José

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:32 PM

I don't really find that weird. Some Dr and nurses will ask permission before they touch you or at least tell you what they are about to do. And if I could get a pap smear without being touched I think that would be great! When I was training to be a swim teacher I was told to ask children prior to touching them especially when teaching breast stroke I find I might needto ttouch feet/ legs to help kids get the idea of how it is supposed to feel. I guess the difference is ur discussing babieswwho can't talk and they r ur baby. Still, I think it models respectful behaviour and gives them, when older, the opportunity to say they don't want a massage.

Edited by feliz6, 05 January 2013 - 01:34 PM.


#6 Guest_Sunnycat_*

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:32 PM

I did baby massage and was told the same thing. I have always told DS before we are about to change his nappy or massage him or wash him, don't do it so much anymore (still do regarding the nappy change), I just want to reassure him when he was a newbie.

#7 Expelliarmus

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:36 PM

I went with the 'telling them what's going on as you do it' approach. It ended up being a more natural set of questions.

"Oh you're sad? Mummy's going to pick you up. Do you want something to eat? Oooh smelly bum, let's change your bum first then you'll feel better. Let's go to the change table, just take this one off, isn't that better? Yes it is! Ooooh squirmy baby, let's put a new one on, ah there you go, all better! Oh no, you don't like that? Oh I'll just cover up your little feet ..." etc etc

As they got older they responded non verbally and verbally and I took those cues rather than asking permission. "Oh you don't like that, do you, I'll stop, want me to stroke your back instead of pat ... hmmm you like that I think ..." It just evolved a bit more naturally and by the time they could respond questions like that came as part of the normal interactions and the child was able to respond.

#8 OneProudMum

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:38 PM

QUOTE (Sunnycat @ 05/01/2013, 02:32 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I did baby massage and was told the same thing. I have always told DS before we are about to change his nappy or massage him or wash him, don't do it so much anymore (still do regarding the nappy change), I just want to reassure him when he was a newbie.


Is the sort of thing you say more like "mummy is just changing your nappy now" (this is what I do).

Or do you actually ask "is it ok if mummy changes your nappy now?"



#9 tickledpink72

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:39 PM

Sorry, I find that REALLY weird, but I never did baby massage.  Especially the bath & nappy change "consent"...there is no option to say "no" to either for my DS.

#10 OneProudMum

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:40 PM

QUOTE (howdo @ 05/01/2013, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I went with the 'telling them what's going on as you do it' approach. It ended up being a more natural set of questions.

"Oh you're sad? Mummy's going to pick you up. Do you want something to eat? Oooh smelly bum, let's change your bum first then you'll feel better. Let's go to the change table, just take this one off, isn't that better? Yes it is! Ooooh squirmy baby, let's put a new one on, ah there you go, all better! Oh no, you don't like that? Oh I'll just cover up your little feet ..." etc etc

As they got older they responded non verbally and verbally and I took those cues rather than asking permission. "Oh you don't like that, do you, I'll stop, want me to stroke your back instead of pat ... hmmm you like that I think ..." It just evolved a bit more naturally and by the time they could respond questions like that came as part of the normal interactions and the child was able to respond.


Great so what I'm doing is the same. Thanks!

#11 ekbaby

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:41 PM

I don't think it's weird. I probably take it the way howdo said. I.e. talking to baby when about to change them, telling then what is happening, rather than just ripping it off. Also with baby massage they were probably making the point that not all babies like being massaged or there might be time when your baby is fractious/tired etc and a massage is just upsetting them rather than being a nice bonding activity, I guess they are just saying listen to your baby and watch their cues.

#12 HeroOfCanton

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:41 PM

Sounds fair enough, I guess - but as roseibird said it, informal.

I've never asked permission to change, massage, wash my children, but I do always talk them through what I'm going to do.
I never just scoop them off the floor and toss them on the change table; I would say "okay Atlas, let's change your nappy. Would you like a blue one this time"
or with DD, I'll ask her to choose a nappy for herself, then we talk through how we change a nappy (commentary of the type of poo included - courteousy of the toddler  sick.gif)

#13 Frockme

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:42 PM

Oh for heavens sake, ask them if they want a shower or nappy change? Seems so extreme. .  biggrin.gif  If I didn't insist on my dd showering / bathing and sometimes going to the toilet she never would. Well she would of course but only when it suited her. Now I don't let a 2 yO rule my life now or ever lol. Telling a child what's coming up or having a good routine in place seems more sensible.
For massage yes ok, ask. They aren't there of their own accord anyway so seems a bit silly. I'm sure there are better ways to teach the things.

#14 rosiebird

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:42 PM

I say "nappy time cutie!! Can we change your nappy now? Come on sweetie, up you come". Nappy time is less negotiable than massage time though! I don't think it's the words so much as the spirit - that you are looking for cues to see whether the baby is enjoying massage time to decide whether to continue of not.

I'm not sure why a *warning -sensitive * was needed though!

#15 Mumto1feral

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:43 PM

I don't think it's weird at all. I remember Pinky McKay suggests doing it this way too when I read me of her books. I think i also remember reading somewhere else thats it's partly to do with teaching your child about boundaries and instilling in your child that they are individuals and have rights about what happens to their own bodies, which in turn supposed to be a protective mechanism against child sexual abuse.

#16 OneProudMum

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:43 PM

QUOTE (tickledpink72 @ 05/01/2013, 02:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sorry, I find that REALLY weird, but I never did baby massage.  Especially the bath & nappy change "consent"...there is no option to say "no" to either for my DS.


It was probably not "can I change your nappy? sort of consent possibly more "is it ok if I xyz?"

#17 OneProudMum

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:45 PM

QUOTE (rosiebird @ 05/01/2013, 02:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I say "nappy time cutie!! Can we change your nappy now? Come on sweetie, up you come". Nappy time is less negotiable than massage time though! I don't think it's the words so much as the spirit - that you are looking for cues to see whether the baby is enjoying massage time to decide whether to continue of not.

I'm not sure why a *warning -sensitive * was needed though!


I thought it would be best to put it there and gauge response rather than possibly upsetting someone.

#18 Guest_Sunnycat_*

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:48 PM

QUOTE (OneProudMum @ 05/01/2013, 01:38 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Is the sort of thing you say more like "mummy is just changing your nappy now" (this is what I do).

Or do you actually ask "is it ok if mummy changes your nappy now?"


Yeah, especially in the early days when he screamed blue murder, I'd try and reassure him and just tell him, "it's all okay, I'm just going to change your nappy".

With the massage was the same, something like "I'm going to give you a massage to help you relax". I didn't do massage that often and DS was always the type of child who loves to be cuddled or touched so didn't really make much difference to us.

#19 Maple Leaf

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:49 PM

I never asked 'permission' for bathing or nappy changes.

It's more like "nappy time!".

Or "time to hop in the bath". I would never use a questioning voice with either of those things as my kids would assume they had a choice and take off running and think it was a huge game watching Mum wrangle them into the tub!

#20 Guest_Sunnycat_*

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:49 PM

QUOTE (OneProudMum @ 05/01/2013, 01:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I thought it would be best to put it there and gauge response rather than possibly upsetting someone.


When we did the baby massage, the woman said it was good to start getting in the habit of asking permission before touching your kids as it helps teach them that their body is their own and the orders need consent to touch them and that it is okay for them to say no. I don't know if it's something that needs to be taught when they're that young but in theory I think it's a good idea.

#21 Expelliarmus

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:55 PM

I do understand the theory but for babies I don't think it's appropriate to be perfectly honest. Babies need people to touch them and do things for them. In fact babies need touch. But if you've been talking to your baby and responding to their cues since birth in some manner than as they can do things for themselves you can gradually modify what you are saying to include asking for permissions when appropriate. It's a gradual thing. shrug.gif

#22 Oriental lily

Posted 05 January 2013 - 01:58 PM

I think is fine to do it if you find that useful but I am really not sure it achieves much.


There is negotiable things and non negotiable.

Massage is negotiable.
The whole point of it is to relax your baby, that's hardly going to happen if the child does not want it.

The same as a hug.

However asking child if they want a bath is pointless because it will happen anyway.

I am also a bit scepitical of the current pop psychology of treating your child as a equal. And that their needs and wants are important as yours.

Sounds sweet and lovely in theory however
It seems to be missing the reality that children and even teens are not rationale people.

Doing a running commentary on what your going to do is totally different because it helps with speech and helps prepare and make a baby feel secure.


#23 kpingitquiet

Posted 05 January 2013 - 02:00 PM

I certainly don't do it. Just last night my 2yo was sitting on my lap watching Driver Dan and I gave her a backrub. shrug.gif If she doesn't like something she says "No! Dun liiiike it" so that's pretty clear indication she's not up for it biggrin.gif I personally think parent-child trust is built by not harming them, being there when they need you, and being their support, not by treating them in an unfamiliar, professional manner. And gosh knows I never ask if she minds if I change her diaper or if dad takes her for bathtime. The kid would have a 3-ton diaper by now and would have bathed maybe twice since she learned to speak if we did that.

#24 MinkyMonkey

Posted 05 January 2013 - 02:07 PM

QUOTE (Mumto1bub @ 05/01/2013, 01:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't think it's weird at all. I remember Pinky McKay suggests doing it this way too when I read me of her books. I think i also remember reading somewhere else thats it's partly to do with teaching your child about boundaries and instilling in your child that they are individuals and have rights about what happens to their own bodies, which in turn supposed to be a protective mechanism against child sexual abuse.


yyes.gif

I also did infant massage and always asked permission, like most PP with nappies changes, baths etc. it was more like letting her know what was going on than asking permission per se.

#25 MinkyMonkey

Posted 05 January 2013 - 02:10 PM

QUOTE (Sunnycat @ 05/01/2013, 01:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
When we did the baby massage, the woman said it was good to start getting in the habit of asking permission before touching your kids as it helps teach them that their body is their own and the orders need consent to touch them and that it is okay for them to say no. I don't know if it's something that needs to be taught when they're that young but in theory I think it's a good idea.


I think it's a good habit to get into so you may as well start straight away, kind of like please and thank you.




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users

 

Win $1000 with Sea-Bands!

Three lucky fans can win a Sea-Band prize pack valued at over $1000 each, which includes two Sea-Bands plus a $1000 Eftpos gift card!

Misery loves Facebook

Facebook users are often criticised for only showing the positive, fun parts of their lives. But what about when it swings the other way, when someone uses it for the purposes of ranting about their children all the time, never posting anything positive?

Toddler's adorable impersonation of pregnant mum

Little Ellis has noticed his mum is walking differently lately, and his impersonation of her is hilarious.

'Forgotten baby syndrome' can happen to any one of us

When my third child was two months old, I strapped her into her car seat, then promptly forgot all about her. But she survived, unharmed, because it was winter, and I was lucky.

Join the Real Mums Test Drive Team

Five mums or mums-to-be will join the EB Test Drive Team and discover great items at an exclusive Big W event. (Sydney only.)

Ten things I've learned about motherhood

Never take a good night's sleep for granted. There is no logic like toddler logic. Standing on Lego hurts every time. These are the truths of parenthood.

Parenting past the toddler years: what's next?

Your baby has grown into a toddler, and now your toddler is fast approaching the preschooler stage. What can you expect as a parent?

Tips on what to pack in your hospital bag

Before giving birth I read countless lists, ended up overpacking just a little, and now know what I'll actually want to pack next time.

New app keeps tabs on your kids at childcare

Popular new technology lets parents know what their children are up to at childcare - but not everyone is a fan.

21 things I love about newborns

There?s an irresistible magic about newborns. Of course they're not all smiles and rainbows, but they are undeniably cute and remarkable in so, so many ways.

Kid-friendly hairdressers: who says haircuts can?t be fun?

I?ve found some salons who boast setups ideal for children ? you name it, they?ve thought of it. All are designed to make haircuts fun rather than stressful.

Labour pain relief may reduce risk of postnatal depression: study

Postnatal depression is a complex condition, but researchers say pain relief during labour may help some women.

Why we need better support for men after miscarriage

In a recent study, 85 per cent of men admitted feeling sadness after their partner miscarried, but almost half said they didn't share their feelings at all. What can be done to help them?

Mum in business: Kristy Chong

Kristy Chong is the managing director of Australian-made Modibodi underwear and a mum to Lucas, 6, Jason, 4, and Isaac, 6 months. She shares her advice for other mums thinking about starting their own businesses.

From toddler to preschooler: a developmental roadmap

So your toddler is growing up and will soon be entering the preschooler years. Here are a few ways to frame their development that will help you understand what?s going in those beautiful, funny, clever little heads of theirs.

Mum sacrifices an eye for her unborn baby

Motherhood is full of sacrifices, but this woman has made a life-altering one - and her baby hasn't even been born.

A grandparent by any other name

A growing number of grandparents are shunning tradition and going against conventional names - but a grandparent by any other name still gives the same awesome cuddles and kisses.

Photographer captures the beauty of adoption

The love of a family is usually tough to capture on camera. This is an exception.

When labour just doesn't happen

After three healthy kids, I can?t help feeling I?ve been a little ripped off. I missed out on something I had always wanted to experience, and now I?ll never get the chance.

Be careful what you say, your baby is listening

The importance of speaking to your baby even if they are not old enough to answer back has been highlighted by new research.

Share the little things that make you smile

We're giving away a Mountain Buggy nano, the ultimate travel stroller - and here are some of the great entries so far.

Win a Mountain Buggy nano

We?re giving away the new Mountain Buggy Nano - the lightweight travel buggy! So show us the little things that make you smile for your chance to win.

Download now: Essential Kids Activity Finder app

Got bored kids? Quickly find the best activities for kids wherever you are in Australia with the Essential Kids app.

 
Advertisement
 
Advertisement
 
 
 

What's hot on EB

Win a Mountain Buggy nano

We?re giving away the new Mountain Buggy Nano - the lightweight travel buggy! So show us the little things that make you smile for your chance to win.

Be careful what you say, your baby is listening

The importance of speaking to your baby even if they are not old enough to answer back has been highlighted by new research.

Win $1000 with Sea-Bands!

Three lucky fans can win a Sea-Band prize pack valued at over $1000 each, which includes two Sea-Bands plus a $1000 Eftpos gift card!

The beautiful moment a baby was born at the side of a road

It's not where she expected to give birth, but mum Corrine Cinatl is delighted that her daughter's roadside arrival was captured in a series of beautiful photos.

Doctor sings first Happy Birthday to newborns

His job is to deliver babies, but this US obstetrician also has a unique way of celebrating the miracle of life.

Join the Real Mums Test Drive Team

Five mums or mums-to-be will join the EB Test Drive Team and discover great items at an exclusive Big W event. (Sydney only.)

The Nappy Collective starts new drive

It's that time of year when the dedicated volunteers at The Nappy Collective do their bit to help out mums and children in need - and they need your help.

Baby shower cake wrecks

From misshapen cake babies to questionable text, from odd colour choices to internal organ recreation, these are the baby shower cakes that taste forgot.

Photographer captures the beauty of adoption

The love of a family is usually tough to capture on camera. This is an exception.

Pregnancy progression photo ideas

Want to record your pregnancy as your belly grows? Here are some creative, fun ideas for photo shoots along the way.

The myths and facts about "normal" breastfeeding

When it comes to successful breastfeeding, there is a wide variety to what is "normal", according to new research.

Tin can craft and DIY ideas

Got a few old formula, Milo or coffee cans around the house? Use these fantastic upcycling ideas to create items for around the house and yard.

Dads meet their newborn for the first time

Emotional photos of two fathers meeting their newborn son have resonated with viewers worldwide, attracting thousands of Facebook likes and shares.

Skin safety isn't just a summer worry

Lax about the slip slop slap with your kids as weather turns cooler? Here's a reminder as to why we have to remain vigilant for our children?s future health.

Personalised baby gifts

We've scoured the internet to find gorgeous personalised keepsakes and nursery decor to record baby name and dates. They make great gifts for christenings, name days and birthdays! (All prices in AU.)

Creative sleeping baby photoshoots

See how some parents and photographers have captured sleeping babies in unusual positions and using different props.

DIY kitchen and food hacks

DIY your way to a better kitchen and make cooking easier with our clever hacks. (Some content reproduced with permission from mashable.com.)

Winter warmers for babies and toddlers

Your baby or toddler will be nice and snug in these beautiful and fun winter pieces. Most are hand-made or knitted, and they're all designed to keep your little one toastie - and adorable!

 

Mind, body, beauty, life

Making time for me

We look at your wellbeing, covering health, relationships, beauty and fashion, mind and body.

 
Advertisement
 
 
Essential Baby and Essential Kids is the place to find parenting information and parenting support relating to conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids, maternity, family budgeting, family travel, nutrition and wellbeing, family entertainment, kids entertainment, tips for the family home, child-friendly recipes and parenting. Try our pregnancy due date calculator to determine your due date, or our ovulation calculator to predict ovulation and your fertile period. Our pregnancy week by week guide shows your baby's stages of development. Access our very active mum's discussion groups in the Essential Baby forums or the Essential Kids forums to talk to mums about conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids and parenting lifestyle. Essential Baby also offers a baby names database of more than 22,000 baby names, popular baby names, boys' names, girls' names and baby names advice in our baby names forum. Essential Kids features a range of free printable worksheets for kids from preschool years through to primary school years. For the latest baby clothes, maternity clothes, maternity accessories, toddler products, kids toys and kids clothing, breastfeeding and other parenting resources, check out Essential Baby and Essential Kids.