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What Happens If I Refuse A VE?

37 replies to this topic

#1 aryastark

Posted 29 December 2012 - 11:56 AM

Today I'm 41 weeks pregnant with my first child and I've already been induced twice and sent home twice. First induction was on the 18th of December and the second was on the 24th. I'm booked in for a 3rd induction on the 2nd of January.

I know that S&Ss aren't meant to be comfortable and generally are quite painful, but the 3rd S&S I had on the 24th of December was absolutely brutal. It's been 5 days and I'm still tender. I'm not sure why I've been induced, twice, as my cervix is high, posterior and unfavourable for induction AND S&Ss, but he still continues to put prostin in. I haven't dilated a single cm.

My 3rd S&S was quite traumatic. I was crying out and swearing, and I said "stop" and "no" more than once. Yesterday was the first time I've been able to talk about it to anyone. I feel really violated and assaulted by the whole experience, and I've been having panic attacks when I think about it happening again. I know that on the 2nd of January he's going to want to do a VE and possibly another S&S and I'm absolutely terrified. What's the next step if I refuse a VE? Will they just do a c-section? I've been begging for a c-section since 38 weeks but no one will listen to me.

People in my DIG think that I should change hospitals, but it's so late in the game. I don't know what to do. I just want my c-section. I don't care anymore.

#2 Soontobegran

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:13 PM

I have no idea what is going on OP?
It seems crazy to me that you'd have had a stretch and sweep if you had a long and posterior cervix and you weren't post term.
Do you have normal BP, is your baby moving well?

I am going to PM you.

#3 aryastark

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:14 PM

My partner is with me 100% of the time with anything to do with the baby, and he saw how I was treated at the 3rd S&S, and he could hear me begging the doctor to stop. He was just frozen with fear because of how much pain I was in.

I don't trust the doctor that if I have a VE he wouldn't just try an S&S. I didn't ask for an S&S the 2nd or the 3rd time. I honestly don't understand a lot of what he's doing and why. My dates put me at 42+1 but hospital dates have me only at 41. He was happy to go with my dates (which is why I was induced) until they didn't fit his schedule (couldn't do a caesar on the 24th, so changed my dates back to hospital dates).

I don't know how to change hospitals now.

ETA- I'm 100% healthy, baby is healthy. Been told (by him) that she's in a great position for birthing and fully engaged. Told my numerous midwives that she's not engaged at all and that she's sitting posterior.

Edited by Luna-baby, 29 December 2012 - 12:16 PM.

#4 BabyHopeful

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:17 PM

Absolutely you can refuse a VE! I had to ask my Dr to do a S&S, he is very hands off.
Are you going public or private? Can you see a different Dr next time?

Honestly I would not be going back to him.

Edited by BabyHopeful, 29 December 2012 - 12:18 PM.

#5 ScarfaceClaw

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:17 PM

Are you public or private OP? You are well within your rights to refuse a VE and also refuse to have this person be your care provider.
I just want to express my sadness that your experience has been traumatic, and hope that when you are ready you can seek some care for yourself to allow you to move through this experience.

I must admit I'm also a little confused by the process of inducing someone who wasn't at due date (according to sig) and you were obviously medically well, as you went home again. Twice.

Good luck x

#6 ubermum

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:17 PM

You are totally within your rights to refuse any and all intervention if you want. You were assaulted. If someone does not stop touching you when you say no, it's assault. Is there any reason that you can't wait until 42 weeks? I had an induction at 42 weeks, I wouldn't consent to one earlier and had no indication for it.

What sort of care model are you using? Private ob?

#7 mum2jp

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:21 PM

I am sure you can refuse one, not sure what the next step would be. With DS i had a S&S at my 41 week appointment in the hope to get things moving (it didn't), then again with gel the night before my induction. I was then induced at almost 42 weeks with the drip the following day. I don't know why your OB has been doing them from week 38, no need to hurry things when your not even overdue yet. As PP said can you take a support person to your next appointment.

If you have requested a C sec why have they said no? Hope you can sort things out. At the end of the day as long as baby arrives safely and you and bub are well thats all that matters. An induction was NOT my ideal birth but after he was born it didn't matter. Although i would request/insist on different things next time round.

#8 BabyHopeful

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:21 PM

Honestly there is no need for him to be doing VE. And I agree with the PP, boardering on abuse when he didn't stop when you asked him to.

#9 HarperLeeAndMe

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:22 PM


#10 Camizebra

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:29 PM

I've got nothing helpful to add, except to say I am so sorry OP.  This is no way for you to be treated my goodness.  I hope everything works out.

#11 aryastark

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:29 PM

OB is public and asked me at 38 weeks if I'd like to have my baby early, where he did the first S&S. I said yes due to severe ligament pains and generally being over pregnancy. I'm healthy, baby is healthy. I didn't know that he wasn't willing to follow through on the inductions if a S&S didn't work. I didn't know I would be sent home when they didn't work, even though I was still contracting.

I feel like it's not my body at all. My request for a c-section has gone unheard since the first induction. I feel abused by the S&S and I feel like I have no right to refuse on the 2nd of Jan.

#12 Eirinn

Posted 29 December 2012 - 12:47 PM

I am so sorry this happened to you OP. There is no way I would be returning to an abusive doctor. He is not showing you good care at all, and I can think of no good reason to induce you at 38 weeks if you and your baby are healthy.

If you really want a caesarean, now that you are 41 weeks the public hospital should be more accommodating of your request. It does sound like you only started wanting a caesar after your first failed induction though?

You are so close to the end, you only have days left. If I were you, I would spend these days looking after yourself. Go and have a massage or something, get your body and mind into the best place it can be for birth. Don't be disheartened by an 'unfavourable' cervix. Some women can be slightly dilated for weeks before labour; others have a high and closed cervix, and go into labour within hours. It doesn't mean anything!

It is your body and your baby, you have the right to refuse anything.

#13 raven74

Posted 29 December 2012 - 01:20 PM

I found sweeps agonising and refused a few. Also refused a couple of VE's prior to labour.  Totally your choice. Have your DH advocate for you if you don't have the strength to do so yourself (totally understandable, too given what you've gone through).
I am really surprised they've tried to induce twice given your dates and your cervix.  It seems the doctor is trying to force you to accomodate to his timetable and not that of your body or your baby.
Stay strong and I hope your baby is here for you soon, on your terms.

#14 axiomae

Posted 29 December 2012 - 01:48 PM

Do not go back to that OB - he is abusive. Refuse him and ask for another one, or change hospitals. It doesn't matter this late in the game - you need to feel comfortable for your baby to have a good labour.

#15 Soontobegran

Posted 29 December 2012 - 01:57 PM

It is difficult to change hospitals and Obstetricians when you live regionally as there is often no choice.
Refuse point blank to have another VE unless you have had symptoms of effacement and dilation like a show or increased vaginal loss. I think you would get your C/S if you get to the 2nd without coming into labour OP.

Lots of luck .

#16 OneProudMum

Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:06 PM

OP I am so sorry you have gone through this.
I completely agree that you have been assaulted.
I know you think it's too late to change hospitals but please give another a call. At least just have a chat to a midwife and get their opinion on the transition.

Remember to trust your instinct always. X

#17 Corella

Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:12 PM

I find it surprising and a little archaic that VEs are done to healthy, normally gestating women in pregnancy at all. There aren't many reasons to do them and they're painful and invasive and it makes me sad to hear how traumatic they were for the OP! As someone said above how dilated you are today doesn't predict what happens tonight or tomorrow but does increase your stress and disconnect, and risk of infection and complications.

#18 Lim Lam

Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:22 PM

OP Im sorry you feel this way, it sounds like assualt to my. I hope u get the delivery you hope for.

ps whats VE?

#19 back*again

Posted 29 December 2012 - 02:33 PM

I've refused a s'n's before, it wasn't treated as a big deal-it was just my choice.

#20 aryastark

Posted 29 December 2012 - 03:49 PM

Thanks for the advice everyone. I've decided to point-blank refuse any sort of intervention unless it's a c-section. There really isn't a lot more they can do, and I really can't see them forcing me down or anything like that. Even if that's a fear, I have my partner with me, and I know he won't let anything happen to me.

Some people aren't made for VB, and I've come to terms with that. Caesarian was always a high possibility given my family history, so I never had my heart set on any sort of birth.

The OB isn't a surgeon, so he won't be the one doing the c-section. I won't have to see him again after I refuse on Wednesday original.gif

#21 kwiggle

Posted 29 December 2012 - 04:33 PM

I know you are really upset by your experience OP, but keep your mind open to whatever comes in terms of birthing. You may go into natural labour any minute now & have a good experience from here. Family history is only part of your story. You can certainly refuse any further interventions, but may I recommend allowing checks on fetal well being if they are recommended. And if part of working out how to help you make decisions about your birth is another VE, do NOT allow anyone you are uncomfortable with perform it - request a different doctor (like the person who would be doing a CS if required) and tell them your story - there are ways to improve the comfort level for you. Honesty is the best policy, screw being polite.Good luck with your birth & I hope you are cuddling a wonderful newborn soon.

#22 Neph

Posted 29 December 2012 - 04:55 PM

OP that is just awful - I really hope you stick to your guns and take control of what happens to YOUR baby and body.  Definitely change doctor there - that's just abuse plain and simple.

With my previous experience I have learned that a lot of midwives/doctors instill unnecessary fear into labouring women and their partners in order to get them to do what THEY want and within THEIR timelines .... if you have your wits about you (not totally off the planet with pain or drugs in those moments) ... say NO to the mass of VEs and other procedures that get pushed on you.

I understand hospital staff have good intentions in most cases but honestly ... going back over my own hospital records there were so many interventions that just did not need to happen.  Baby and I were both not in any distress, other than the constant torture the MWs felt they needed to inflict all the time.

Rediculous *shakes head*

#23 back*again

Posted 29 December 2012 - 05:09 PM

QUOTE (Luna-baby @ 29/12/2012, 03:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Thanks for the advice everyone. I've decided to point-blank refuse any sort of intervention unless it's a c-section. There really isn't a lot more they can do, and I really can't see them forcing me down or anything like that. Even if that's a fear, I have my partner with me, and I know he won't let anything happen to me.

Some people aren't made for VB, and I've come to terms with that. Caesarian was always a high possibility given my family history, so I never had my heart set on any sort of birth.

The OB isn't a surgeon, so he won't be the one doing the c-section. I won't have to see him again after I refuse on Wednesday original.gif

Good for you, just stick to your guns....I've had 6 babies (all in public hospitals) and I've never had a VE.  As other PP said, I can't see the reason for it?

#24 Loz07

Posted 29 December 2012 - 05:17 PM


Yes, you have the right to refuse any sort of care / intervention you wish at any point - including mid procedure (ok, there may be some common sense here like you caan't back out once they have started a caaesar, but mid VE/S&S? Yes). . Any health professional cannot provide care without 'informed consent' - it is a legal and local policy requirement. Providing (or continuing to provide) care without consent is illegal.

The hospital should have a patient/consumer liaison or complaints officer (or similar). You can discuss (in confidence) any aspect of your care with them. If you do not wish to see the same OB again (I wouldn't!) then I would ring them first thing Monday to explain the situation and request an alternative OB be assigned. Alternatively, you may consider contacting them later (when you are comfortable) to inform them of what has happened etc.

Your state health department should also have a consumer charter/rights and responsibilities statement. It may be in the plethora of booklets you have been given, or on their website (if you are in SA pm me and I can give more info...)

Also you may want to check - by definition I believe all OBs are surgeons (although some may choose not to do some procedures etc), so make sure this OB won't be doing your CS (if you have one). Again, contact the liaison officer...

In the meantime, take care of yourself and hope you enter spontaneous labour (oh, and if you do - aagain I would refuse that OB if he happens to be working. Ask for an alternative OB and don't take no for an answer. Escalate to head of department or further if needed)

Good luck

ETA - agree with PP about foetal checks. But maybe scalp monitoring only if indicated (ctg or doppler not enough) and only if you're comfortable

Edited by Loz07, 29 December 2012 - 05:46 PM.

#25 OneProudMum

Posted 29 December 2012 - 06:41 PM

The only VE I have had were:
DS: In labour to check progress once at 6 cms
DD: Twice (with my approval) due to what I thought was PROM and once in labour at 7 cms

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