Jump to content

tales of a teenage genius
explain to me about genius and aspergers


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 mum850

Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:43 PM

Screening on abc 2 now.

What is the relationship between asperger's  and genius?

What is primary? Do you have asperger's cos your brain is so brilliant and you think/communicate  in a different way?
Do you have genius (in this case maths) as a 'splinter skill' to do with having asperger's?

Have I just got it totally wrong?

Help me BMJ!



#2 katrina24

Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:49 PM

Hi, I'm not an expert but I think that they (Aspergers and giftedness) are separate things which sometimes co-occur. I think a splinter skill is different to genius. To me, a splinter skill is something that is out of step with development and general cognition.  If someone has a very superior IQ (whether that is verbal, performance or overall) I wouldn't refer to that as a splinter skill.



#3 mum850

Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:54 PM

I am so not an expert either  biggrin.gif but I personally 'know' (mostly online it has to be said) a lot of highly gifted kids with aspergers. But also in real life, adults and children.
Of course I also know kids with aspergers who are NOT gifted, and kids with intellectual impairment and autistic spectrum disorders.


#4 pundelina

Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:57 PM

They do occur together, just as brown hair co-occurs with blue eyes.

Not always, not often really, so it's unusual enough to be noticed when it does.



#5 EBeditor

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:06 PM

It's a great show, I'm watching it now. What a lovely kid.

#6 mum850

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:07 PM

You are saying that the incidence of high or very high IQ is NOT higher in those with Asperger's?

Argh this has been bugging me for years. I would like to understand it better.

I am  saying Aspergers  because I know that autism is not  associated with higher IQ.

Very interesting program. His parents seem lovely.

OK I can verbalise this question better. Does the IQ of people with Aspergers follow a normal distribution.

#7 katrina24

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:15 PM

Hi again, my understanding is that, in the DSM IV, to qualify for a diagnosis of Aspergers you can't have cognitive impairments. From this I infer that the distribution of IQ would not follow a 'normal' bell curve (because the bottom half of the curve is missing).  I also believe that in the DSM V Aspergers will no longer be a diagnosis.  Happy to have my understanding corrected by someone more knowledgeable though.

#8 mum850

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:18 PM

QUOTE (katrina24 @ 05/12/2012, 10:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Hi again, my understanding is that, in the DSM IV, to qualify for a diagnosis of Aspergers you can't have cognitive impairments. From this I infer that the distribution of IQ would not follow a 'normal' bell curve (because the bottom half of the curve is missing).  I also believe that in the DSM V Aspergers will no longer be a diagnosis.  Happy to have my understanding corrected by someone more knowledgeable though.


Ha yes I did know the bit about the bottom of the curve, cos if you have intellectual impairment you are excluded from the diagnosis. But it made my question less neat. Sorry.
I will redo.....

Does the distribution of IQs among people with Asperger's follow a normal distribution apart from at the lower range? I am sure if I actually knew some stats I could say that in a nicer way!

#9 Acidulous Osprey

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:20 PM

The diagnostic criteria for Aspergers is a normal or higher IQ. Not everyone with an Aspergers diagnosis is gifted or has splinter skills.  Some people with Aspergers have high IQs but the majority do not.  The majority of people with Aspergers also do not have splinter skills (it actually really irks me that this is even a thing for people with Aspergers as I think splinter skills are people like Stephen Wiltshire).

Another very real issue for kids with Aspergers is that often they will be really bright (doesn't mean genius) but will have learning issues which impact on how they can demonstrate their intelligence.  If you have a handwriting disorder or executive functioning disorder, you're going to struggle to take notes and to show what you know in an exam situation.

Oh and as of next year it gets more interesting as Aspergers is disappearing as a stand alone diagnosis under the DSM V

#10 pundelina

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:20 PM

Yes.

Right now there are three 'labels' we attach to people diagnosed as being on the Autism Spectrum.

Autistic Disorder (including High-function Autistic Disorder where IQ >70 ... HFA does not mean above average intelligence, merely not intellectually impaired).
Aspergers - same traits as AD but no significant general language delay or cognitive delay.

This will all change next year with the DSM-5, whereupon there will be no more Aspergers and instead a general Autism Spectrum Disorder to catch all. Which has good and bad sides and is another discussion altogether.

#11 jayskette

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:21 PM

QUOTE (mum850 @ 05/12/2012, 10:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You are saying that the incidence of high or very high IQ is NOT higher in those with Asperger's?


Shouldn't it be the other way round? aspergers is a more likely subset among the high IQ subset.

omg. Cameron's story really reminds me of DH. sad.gif It would be so hard to parent a kid like that.

#12 mum850

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:26 PM

Prof Leader, his maths mentor, seems a really lovely guy with a great perspective. He wants Cameron to slow down in his maths progression.

is your DH like that jayskette?

#13 katrina24

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:31 PM

You might find this interesting

http://www.nagcbritain.org.uk/file_upload/factsheets/P84.pdf



#14 Acidulous Osprey

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:35 PM

QUOTE (jayskette @ 05/12/2012, 09:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Shouldn't it be the other way round? aspergers is a more likely subset among the high IQ subset.

omg. Cameron's story really reminds me of DH. sad.gif It would be so hard to parent a kid like that.



No it isn't, it really isn't.  Compared to other parenting issues, it's not that hard.  It's way harder if they have a 160 IQ and dyslexia/dyspraxia/handwriting disorder in addition to Aspergers.  People I know with kids with straight forward Aspergers and a profoundly gifted IQ had a walk in the park compared to those of us with more complex stuff.

Pundelina I have one kid with an IQ of under 70 (which nobody believes but that's how he tests) and he has the diagnosis of HFA.

#15 pundelina

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:36 PM

The reference that fact sheet is using for stating that people with Aspergers "usually have above-average intelligence" actually says

"Children with Asperger syndrome usually have intelligence within the normal range. Some children have particular skills in areas that require logic, memory and creativity, such as maths, computer science and music."  http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/autistic-spec...troduction.aspx

It does not state that they usually have above-average intelligence. I hate it when references are completely misused.

#16 katrina24

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:41 PM

Hi PP, are you referring to the link I posted? I wasn't suggesting it was saying kids with Aspergers had a higher incidence of being gifted. I just thought the OP might find it interesting.  

The only thing I know/believe about the IQ of people with Aspergers is what I have read in the diagnostic criteria (ie. no deficit in cognitive functioning). I have no idea if the incidence of giftedness is higher in people with Aspergers therefore haven't commented on it.

Sorry if I caused any confusion.

#17 pundelina

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:41 PM

QUOTE (Balzac @ 05/12/2012, 10:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
...Pundelina I have one kid with an IQ of under 70 (which nobody believes but that's how he tests) and he has the diagnosis of HFA.


That's unusual. Perhaps it because of the disbelief in his testing that he has the HFA label.

It's all by-the-by anyway, labels are just boxes that aid in treatment (hopefully) so as long as he's getting the right interventions/understanding then I don't believe that the label itself really matters.

#18 pundelina

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:43 PM

katrina24, I was referring to the fact-sheet you posted, but my complaint was about the fact-sheet sloppy-fact-checker-writers, not with you.

original.gif

#19 katrina24

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:46 PM

Ah Pundalina, I just re read your post and realised what you were saying about the reference used in the link.  I see what you are saying now. Think I need to get to bed, my reading comprehension is obviously not so hot at this hour!

Edited by katrina24, 05 December 2012 - 09:46 PM.


#20 Acidulous Osprey

Posted 05 December 2012 - 09:47 PM

Yeah it probably is to do with how he actually functions as opposed to the test.  He had the HFA diagnosis (and holy jesus, he was teacher identified as gifted) prior to the IQ test.

#21 ~ky~

Posted 06 December 2012 - 12:26 AM

I'm watching it now ... he reminds me so much of my DS. His mannerisms, way of speaking, sense of humour, disolving into tears when things aren't perfect etc.

Biggest difference is that my DS doesn't test well and will never be pegged as a genius. I know he is brighter than his sister and she has been identified as gifted.

#22 baddmammajamma

Posted 08 December 2012 - 11:02 PM

I have it taped and am so eager to watch it!

As mum850 and Balzac know, an issue that really gets to me is when some parents of gifted kids attribute ALL of their child's quirks and struggles to a high IQ and potentially miss out on an appropriate ASD diagnosis (or other dx). I'm glad that there are shows featuring twice exceptional people, as it's good to remind the viewing public that giftedness and special needs and/or learning disabilities can go hand in hand.

(steps off soapbox)




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users

 

Ada Nicodemou: 'I can never be completely happy again'

Home and Away actress Ada Nicodemou has opened up about the loss of her stillborn baby.

10 things to consider when you're thinking about trying for a baby

Before you start tracking your menstrual cycle and reading up on the best positions to get pregnant, there are a few other things you may want to consider.

Baby Gammy's dad tries to claim charity money

The biological father of baby Gammy has reportedly tried to access charity money raised for the little boy's medical costs.

How special surgery and IVF can create a post-vasectomy baby

Cricket legend Glenn McGrath and his second wife Sara are expecting their first child together, thanks to IVF and a delicate surgical sperm retrieval process that helped the couple to conceive.

Belle Gibson's mother 'disgusted and embarrassed'

The mother of disgraced wellness blogger Belle Gibson has accused her daughter of lying about her childhood in an attempt to garner public sympathy.

Life On Mars

It's men who need 'retraining', not women

We are all responsible for our own behaviour. Telling victims to harden up is wrong.

Doctor's mobile phone 'left inside c-section mum'

A new mum claims a doctor left his mobile phone inside her after delivering her baby via caesarean section.

I'm a mum and I'm following my dreams

I want my kids to know that no matter what happens in life, you can still be who it is that you've always wanted to be.

Those first daycare days

I had this innate 'mum' moment the other day.

'If one person had listened, my life would have been so different'

Katherine's father will die in prison for the horrifying sexual abuse of his daughter. Yet she is the one with the true life sentence.

Couple to celebrate terminally ill baby's birthday in unique way

Baby Jai Bishop has lived at Starship Hospital for the past seven months, with his parents flying back and forth from Hokitika, 1100km away, to be by his side.

This new plan undermines breastfeeding and baby health at everyone's expense

Mothers, babies, the health system and the wider society are going to pay the price of this new budget.

Trying to understand why your baby is upset

Working out what?s underlying your baby's fussiness can be a case of trial and error. Here are a few common causes and how you can remedy each one.

When those you love judge your parenting

In today's society, never has it been harder to parent without judgment. But what about when judgment is coming from closer to home?

Don't play the victim blame game with family violence

It's not a woman's job to teach violent men how to behave.

11 truths about having two under two

When I told my mothers? group that my husband and I had started trying for our second baby they told me I was crazy. Now I can see why.

'How do you say goodbye to someone you've only just started to get to know?'

New mum Sarah Sutton was faced with a shattering scenario no person should have to endure.

It's a ... boy! Couple welcomes son number 13

"It's a boy!" That's the phrase Kateri Schwandt has heard in labour delivery ward for the 13th time in her life.

Six reasons to go for a walk

Can't find time to get to the gym? It could be just as beneficial to put your baby in the stroller and go for a walk.

Seven questions you should be asking about your health cover

If the last time you assessed your health cover was five years ago, there?s a chance it may no longer suit your needs. To ensure it?s still right for your family, click here for seven questions to ask.

 
Advertisement
 
Advertisement
 
 
 

What's hot on EB

Where are the childcare places?

It?s all very well to encourage women to work if they choose to, but how can the measures lead to increased workforce participation when women are once again left holding the baby?

The pain of not having babies and not knowing why

After seven years of wishing, hoping, crying, punching pillows and shouting "why me?!", the end result is more than I ever thought possible.

Getting your family finances in order

Whether you're after a new car for a growing family, a bigger house, or are just fixing up your finances, here are the basics on borrowing.

Mum shares graphic selfie to warn against tanning

A mum has shared a graphic photo of her skin cancer treatment as a warning to others.

Does parenthood make us happier?

We can certainly gain higher levels of happiness when we become parents, but the trick is to not get overwhelmed by the pressures of raising our kids.

No, having a dog is not like having a human child

It's obvious these people dote on their pets, but they're barking up the wrong tree.

Toddler styling

Seven things my toddler taught me about my home

My standards at home were never that high but having a two-year-old has taught me to be cool with chaos.

Australia's top baby names of 2014

The numbers have been crunched and it's official: Australian parents are having a bit of an 'O' moment.

How to set up the perfect nursery for your baby

You'll soon be meeting your baby, but you've got one big task to get done first: setting up a comfy, calming nursery you'll both be able to enjoy.

Childcare rebate: tougher rules for stay-at-home mums

A new form of activity testing will be introduced to ensure the highest subsidies go to parents who contribute the most to the workforce.

The women who desperately need more support in pregnancy

For women suffering from chronic morning sickness or hyperemesis gravidarum, pregnancy can be the roller coaster from hell.

When labour doesn't happen and you're induced

I never actually went into labour - so by 42 weeks I was booked in for induction.

Mum's grief for triplets inspires change

The death of Sophie Smith's triplet baby boys has motivated the half-marathon mother and her team to raise $1.25 million for charity.

The best advice for treating head lice

Just like a horror movie ... THEY'RE BAAAAAACK. So what works in treating and avoiding head lice and nits?

Overdue and over it

A watched womb never labours ... or at least mine didn't.

Parenting an early walker

Watching your child take their first wobbly steps is one of the best parenting highs you'll ever experience. But with that high comes a new reality.

Baby-led weaning worked for us

My baby wasn't interested in food - until we tried something new. Now she's eating it all, and it often comes from my plate.

'Paralysed bride' becomes a mum

Rachelle Friedman Chapman was preparing to marry the man of her dreams when tragedy struck four years ago.

 

Top baby names

Baby Names

The numbers are in and we can now bring you the 2014 top baby name list for Australia.

 
Advertisement
 
 
Essential Baby and Essential Kids is the place to find parenting information and parenting support relating to conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids, maternity, family budgeting, family travel, nutrition and wellbeing, family entertainment, kids entertainment, tips for the family home, child-friendly recipes and parenting. Try our pregnancy due date calculator to determine your due date, or our ovulation calculator to predict ovulation and your fertile period. Our pregnancy week by week guide shows your baby's stages of development. Access our very active mum's discussion groups in the Essential Baby forums or the Essential Kids forums to talk to mums about conception, pregnancy, birth, babies, toddlers, kids and parenting lifestyle. Essential Baby also offers a baby names database of more than 22,000 baby names, popular baby names, boys' names, girls' names and baby names advice in our baby names forum. Essential Kids features a range of free printable worksheets for kids from preschool years through to primary school years. For the latest baby clothes, maternity clothes, maternity accessories, toddler products, kids toys and kids clothing, breastfeeding and other parenting resources, check out Essential Baby and Essential Kids.